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probability of getting a better bench than we now had, and yet we had been told by a delegate here that the people imperatively require a change of men as well as tenure. Now, if the gentleman would show that the people had suffered injustice--that the judges were corrupt--that they had given wrong decisions, or that the law was not properly administered, then he (Mr. Merrill) would be able to see how the interests of the people were to be protected by the proposed change of judges. But when, on the contrary, we heard quite a different statement from every part of the hall,-how, he desired to know, were the interests of the people to be promoted by such a change?

With respect to the proposed classification, he would say that if there was to be any, the better course to adopt would be to let those who had been longest in office remain. Indeed, he thought the whole argument in favor of a classification untenable, and the plan proposed had neither reason nor justice to recommend it. Gentlemen had argued that there would be too many judges to be re-appointed at the end of fifteen years. if all these were to come before the governor. Did gentlemen really suppose that all these men would be applicants at that period? Surely gentlemen had not considered the subject with sufficient attention, or they would not have entertained the views which they seemed to do. He had been no advocate for giving the senate a participation in the power of appointment. It was true that the governor and senate might make some very good appointments in one instance, whilst they would make some very bad ones in another. Hemust say that he was greatly astonished to hear a gentleman remark that a new governor might, be influenced, on just taking office, by those of his own party who would flock to the seat of government for the purpose of obtaining appointments. This and other arguments of that character, had been met and fully rebutted when the tenure of office of the governor was the subject of discussion. He did not doubt that the governor would be a highminded and honorable man, and above the reach of influence of this sort. Then why not let him make the appointments himself. He wholly disapproved of the proposed introduction of the graduation principle in reference to the tenure of the present judges of the supreme court. He thought it would create much bickering and unpleasant feeling among them, and that no necessity existed for the distinction. Some time ago he had taken occasion to refer to what had been done by the convention, and to say that there were members of a great party of Pennsyl vania called " destructives," who, by their action in this convention, seemed to have lost sight of the interests of the people, and that it would have the effect of destroying all that had been done which was worthy of preservation. He had said, also, that he could not believe it was their intention to commit suicide. He, however, now regretted to say that owing to the sincerity displayed by gentlemen, and the manner in which they had pressed their amendments, he felt himself compelled to relinquish that doubt. He thought it strange that they should bring for ward so many amendments, unless their object was to defeat all amendments of the constitution, as there were thousands in favor of making certain amendments who would not go to the extent of supporting so great a number as had been introduced.

He maintained that no amendment should be adopted affecting the

present incumbents in office, and that gentlemen of the reform party would find themselves mistaken, if they imagined that all the amendments would be voted for, and approved by the people. Great difference of opinion would be found to exist amongst the people in reference to many important questions that had been decided by this convention, as to bank charters, the militia, the insertion of the word "white," and other amendments. The impression on his mind was, that owing to the great number of amendments which had been made, they would all be voted down. Gentlemen here seemed to think there was something so excellent in their amendments, that the people will adopt them without reference to those which are considered exceptionable. I might suit the gentleman from Bucks, (Mr. M'Dowell) to have his party disorganized; but how would it suit the party themselves? They could best answer that question. After considerable doubt, he confessed that he had come to the conclusion to vote for the longest terms, as being the only course left him to adopt. The objections he entertained did not rest altogether on constitutional grounds, for he knew that the constitution provides that the people may alter or abolish it when they please. Under this knowledge the judges accepted their offices. The framers of the constitution knew the people of Pennsylvania to be steady, sober, and sagacious, and they did not entertain an idea that the fundamental law of the commonwealth would be changed in their day. It had been intimated in the course of this debate that the judges had easy duties to perform. This was not the fact, as every lawyer could testify. They had very laborious duties to discharge; and he could speak particularly in reference to the judge in his own county, as an instance. It was well known that the judges do not make so much money as counsel. And, many a man has accepted office, and afterwards been extremely sony for having done Gentlemen might think that the judges were amply provided for, but they were much mistaken. These officers dreaded quarter day, as it not unfrequently found them unprepared to meet the demand made upon their pockets. He knew that for some time past, a great outcry had been raised about high salaries; but he put no faith in the sincerity of those who raised this cry. It was entirely without foundation. would ask gentlemen to make a calculation of the necessary expenses of a judge, and see if he could have any thing to spare.

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Mr. M. concluded with adverting to the difficulty which an unpright, high-minded and conscientious man would always find in the way of his nomination for the office, in consequence of the number of persons of a different character who would be his rivals, and the means which would be used to defeat him. The inquiry will be constantly made as to every judge in office, whether he has been a good party man, and his re-nomination will be influenced by mere political considerations, more than any question concerning his talents or fitness for his judicial station. He believed that there would be great difficulty in filling the bench with competent individuals, and the fewer appointments that may be required the better.

Mr. DUNLOP, of Franklin, moved that the convention do now adjourn, but the question was decided in the negative;-ayes 48, noes 53.

Mr. DUNLOP then addressed the Chair. Those who were about to be passed upon, he said, should at the least have the privilege to be heard.

If a man were arraigned at the bar for a crime, he would be entitled to a hearing. An impatience seemed to be springing up in this body to prevent a fair hearing. He was against the motion to re-consider, and also against the amendment. He had a modification which he would wish to offer. He did not know whether it had ever struck gentlemen that the judges might resign, and get re-commissioned. If they are disposed to resign before the expiration of their term, for the purpose of being reappointed, this amendment will give such persons the opportunity to do. 80. That any judge of the supreme court would do so, he did not mean to say, but we are holding out here the idea that a judge may resign in order to receive a new commission. One single judge may do so, and this would give the governor power over the bench.

Mr. WOODWARD interrupted. He did not contemplate a course which would be so highly discreditable, and the amendment did not provide against such a contingency.

Mr. DUNLOP resumed. He presumed the objection had struck the gentleman from Luzerne. But he would ask the gentleman if such a thing may not be. He would ask if there was any intention to give the governor this influence over the bench. It is an evil against which we ought to guard by every possible means. To confer this power would be to hold out a premium for the destruction of the bench. This objec tion, he was aware, would not weigh much with those who had made up their minds, right or wrong, to vote for the amendment. But with others who yet rein in doubt, it might have some weight. Look at the list of judges, and it will be manifest that you are about to commit the grossest injustice. Judges Rogers and Histon were both appointed in 1826. On what ground can a different measure of treatment to one of these judges, from that dealt to the other, be justified? Where will be the justice of giving to one of them a tenure of three years, and to the other a tenure of six years? The injustice of such a distinction must be manifest. How can we answer when we are asked why we give to one a three years tenure, and to the other six? In every respect this feature of injustice in the amen lment ought to weigh as an objection. The gentleman from Luzerne undertakes to say that the people desire the irresponsibility of the julges to be taken away. I am a friend of the judiciary—the friend of an indepen lent judiciary, who can act without any improper control, but I deny that there should be irresponsibility on the part of that body. I know no gentleman who boks with a search. ing eye into the construction of governments, who desires the irrespon sibility of the judiciary. Are they not responsible now? Is not the judge in Luzerne, alluded to by the gentleman from that county, responBible; and, if incapable, cannot an application be made to the legislature, and the judge will then be discharge from office, without any imputation of fault or crime? On the address of two-thirds of the legislature the governor may remove the judge without censure. Is he not then responsible? But the gentleman from Luzerne says this is not responsibility. Is he not responsible to the governor? Is not the governor always the representative of the popular voice. The gentleman considers the governor responsible to the people. I would wish to know from the gentleman whether responsibility to Mr. Ritner, is not responsibility to the people? The gentlemen may tell me that Mr. Ritner is a mi.

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nority governor, yet you may make the judge responsible to the people, by making him responsible to the governor. Does the gentle man from Luzerne believe that the governor always makes those appointments which are the most agreeable to the people? I know the genile m: n does not believe so. No governor does this. We know that judges have been appointed, who could not have been appointed to office by a vote of the people.

Ilere Mr. DUNLOP yieided the floor, and.

Mr. DORAN moved that the convention now adjourn.

The question being taken, there appeared-ayes 52, noes 45.

So the motion was decided in the affirn;ative; and,

The convention adjourned..

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TUESDAY, FEBRUARY 20, 1838.

A motion was made by Mr. FRY, and read as follows, viz: Resolved. That so much of the Debates only as have been delivered in committee of the whole, be prepared by the stemnogapher for publication, and that the preparing and printing of those delivered subsequently be dispensed with.

A motion was made by Mr. FRY,

That the convention procecd to the second reading and consideration of the said resolution.

And on the question

Will the convention agree to the motion ?

The yeas and nays were required by Mr. FRY and Mr. SELLERS, and are as follow, viz:

YEAS.- Messrs. Ayres, Banks, Barr dollar, Brown, of Northampton, Clark, of Dauphin, Cox, Crain, Dickerson, Dill nger, Lenagan, Dunlop Fry, Gearhart, Grenell, Harris. Hays. Henderson, of D uphin, Ingersoll, Jenks, Kei nedy, Krels, M'Cahen, M'herry, Merkel Montgomery, Nevin, Overfield, Read, Sellers, Seltzer, Scrr.ll, Smyth, of Centre, Weaver, Young, Sergeant, President-35.

NAYS. Messrs. Agnew, Barc'ay, Barnitz, Bedford, Pell, Biddle, Bigelow, Bonham, Chambers Candler, of Chester. Clauncey, Clarp. Clarke. of Indiana, Cline, Coates, Cochran, Cope, Crawford, Cummin, Cunningham, Curll Darlington, Darrah. Denny, Dickey, Donnell. Farle. Farrelly. Feming, Forward Foulkicd, Fuller. Gemble, Gil more, Has ings. Hayhurst, High, Hopkinson. Houpt, Hyde, Keim. Kenigmacher, Long, Maclay, Mag e.. Martin, M'Lowell Mer dith, Menill, Miller Myes, I ennypacker Porter, of Lancaster, Forter, of Northampton, l'urviance, Reigart, Ritter, Russell Saeger, Scott, Shellito. Smith. of Columbia. Snively, Sterigere, Stevens, Stickel, Taggart. Thomas, Tedd, White, Woodward-71.

the negative.

So the question was determined in Mr. Core, from the committee on accounts, reported the following resolution, viz.:

!

Resolved, That the President draw his warrant on the State Treasurer in favor of Samuel Shoch, for the sum of two thousand five hund.ed do.lars, to be by him accounted for in the settlement of his accounts.

And on motion,

The said resolution was read the second time, considered and adopted.

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Mr. COPE, from the committee on accounts, made the following report, viz:

The committee on accounts have settled the salaries of the secretary, assistant. secretaries and sergeant at-arms of this convention, as follows, viz:

Samuel Shoch, secretary, 90 days, at $3 per day,
Mileage, 106 miles, at fifteen cents per mile,

George I.. Fauss, assistant secretary, 90 days at $7 per day,

Mileage, 108 miles, at fifteen cents per mile,

Joseph Williams, assistant secretary, 90 days, at $7 per day,

Mileage, 15 miles, at fifteen cents per mile,

James E. Mitchel, sergeant-at arms, 90 days, at $3 per day,

Mileage, 306 miles, at fifteen cents per mile,

$720 00
15 90

-8735 90

630 00

16 201

646-20

630 00
2.25

632 25

270 00

45 90

-$315 90

Resolver, That the President draw his warrant on the State Treasurer, in favor of

the above named persons, for the sums set opposite to their respective names.

And on motion,

The said resolution was read the second time,

And being under consideration,

A motion was made by Mr. Meredith,

To amend the said report by adding thereto the following, viz: "To Daniel Eckles, late doorkeeper, and T. J. Beckett, doorkeeper, the sum of fifty dollars each as extra compensation."

A motion was made by Mr. Forward,

To amend the amendment by adding thereto the words " and to James E. Mitchell, sergeant-at-arms, the sum of fifty dollars."

The said amendment to the amen linent being under consideration, Mr. STERIGERE, of Montgomery, demanded the previous question, which was sustained.

And on the question,

Shall the main question be now put?

The yeas and nays were required by Mr. MEREDITH and Mr. HIESTER, and are as follow, viz:

YEAS Messrs. Barclay, Barndollar, Bigelow. Bonham, Brown, of Northampton, Chandler, of Chester, Clarke, of Beaver, Clne, Coates, Crain, Crawford, Crum, Curll, Dar ington, Darrah, Dickerson, Dillinger, Dunlop, Earle, Foulkrod, Fry, Fuller, Gearhart,

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