ALL-AMERICAN CANAL, IN IMPERIAL AND COACHELLA VALLEYS, CALIF. COMMITTEE ON IRRIGATION OF ARID LANDS, The committee met at 10.30 o'clock a. m., Hon. M. P. Kinkaid (chairman) presiding. The CHAIRMAN. The committee will come to order. Now, gentlemen, we are going to restrict the hearing this morning to the issue formed between Mr. Rose from Imperial Valley and the department in regard to the acreage of land that Mr. Rose will be permitted to hold, but as partially introductory we will hear from Attorney Kibbey about this bill now as it is amended and proposed to be amended, this new bill, and if the Commissioner of the General Land Office comes we will cut you off at 5 minutes-not allow you more than 5 minutes if Commissioner Tallman arrives before you get through. You may proceed, Mr. Kibbey, on the bill as it is proposed, and you can refer as far as you please to the Rose proposition. STATEMENT OF MR. WALTER B. KIBBEY, EL CENTRO, CALIF. Mr. KIBBEY. I will not take up very much time, Mr. Chairman. The committee has had the old bill, 6044, before it for a great many months. There was discussion in the Imperial Valley over the provisions of that bill, particularly with reference to the disposition e the lands themselves probably I had better state who I am and w) I represent. Mr. CHAIRMAN. Yes; I wish you would make that plain. Mr. KIBBEY. In the first place I am simply a country lawyer. I live at El Centro, in the Imperial Valley. I have lived there since January, 1914. I came to the Imperial Valley from Los Angeles, having gone to Los Angeles from Arizona. I have lived in an irrigated area all of my life. I lived under the Salt River project before the days when there was any project: I have been through the conditions there as well as in the Imperial Valley. I am now chairman of the land settlement committee of the American Legion of California, and a member of the American Legion. I am also the representative one of the representatives of the committee composed of the committee of five appointed by the Imperial irrigation district. When some of the members of the first committee which were here and this committee is intended to be a continuation of that committee returned to the Imperial Valley, the Amercian Legion was just in formation. The boys were just getting back; the matter was taken up with reference to a soldier preference with the members 863 of that committee. Prior to that time the Spanish-American War veterans had communicated with your committee, I understand. We were informed, and the people of the Imperial Valley were informed, that if the bill was amended to grant a preferential right to exservice men it would kill the bill, and that Congress would, because of that, deny to the people of the Imperial Valley the relief which I think everybody concedes they must have. Our local post of the American Legion was organized, and we then took up the fight. We endeavored to convince them that we did not believe that the American Congress was so constituted that the proposed amendment would have the effect of killing the bill, as they had said. Mr. SUMMERS. Will the gentleman permit me to ask a question? Mr. KIBBEY. Certainly. Mr. SUMMERS. Who gave the impression that an amendment or a provision of that kind in the bill would have that effect? Mr. KIBBEY. The committee which had been here before from the Imperial Valley stated unanimously that that was their opinion. gathered from their visit in Washington. Mr. SUMMERS. It seems very strange, indeed, to me. I can't imagine with whom they had been talking. That was what it seemed to us-very strange. Mr. TAYLOR. I don't believe there was ever any such sentiment here by any member of the committee. Mr. SUMMERS. I have never heard an expression of that kind around this table from any member of the committee. Mr. KIBBEY. I will state that I, as a member of the local Legion. was present at a meeting held with some of the members of that committee, and we tried to get them to state upon what basis they made such a statement. They coined what was to me a new political phrase. They said it was a sixth sense; that it was formed as a result of general conversation. I conceded there might be such a thing as a sixth sense, but that that sixth sense must be based upon some statement made by some one. Mr. SINNOTT. On the fourth dimension, probably. (At this point Commissioner Tallman and Mr. Finney entered the committee room.) The CHAIRMAN. Gentlemen, I feel that we owe you an apology for calling on you so suddenly. It was on account of the misunderstanding about thinking you were notified yesterday. I am glad you have come on such short notice. Mr. LITTLE. Do you represent the settlers or the soldiers, or both? Mr. KIBBEY. Both. Mr. LITTLE. Which ones do you more represent? Mr. KIBBEY. Well, in the first place, I am a resident of Imperial Valley and of the irrigation district. The district appointed me to represent them. The CHAIRMAN. As attorney? Mr. KIBBEY. No: I can not say as attorney. Mr. McPherrin is a director of the district, and also is an attorney, and he is present. The CHAIRMAN. Are you an attorney? Mr. KIBBEY. I am an attorney by profession. I will suspend now. The CHAIRMAN. Now, Mr. Rose, the commissioner is here, and Judge Finney, and they were invited here so that they could hear your case, the case that you are going to make. Do you wish to be heard, either individually or through your attorney, Mr. Gates? Mr. MARK ROSE. I will be heard first, through my attorney. STATEMENT OF MR. R. WOODLAND GATES, COLORADO BUILDING, WASHINGTON, D. C., REPRESENTING THE IMPERIAL-LAGUNA WATER CO. Mr GATES. Mr. Chairman and gentlemen, on the 14th instant Secretary Lane addressed a communication to Mr. Kinkaid reading as follows: MY DEAR MR. KINKAID: In connection with my report to your committee of even date herewith upon H. R. 11553, I inclose for your consideration a petition filed with me by Mr. Mark Rose, president of the Imperial-Laguna Water Co., which petition, in my opinion, presents matters more properly determinable by your committee and by Congress than this department. Cordially, yours, Hon M. P. KINKAID, FRANKLIN K. LANE, Secretary. Chairman Committee on Irrigation of Arid Lands, House of Representatives. With that letter he transmitted a letter addressed to him December 24, 1919, by Mr. Mark Rose and myself, reading as follows: WASHINGTON, D. C., December 24, 1919. The SECRETARY OF THE INTERIOK, Washington, D. C. SIR: In the department's letter of date April 16, 1918, addressed to Mr. Mark Rose, president Imperial-Laguna Water Co., postponing, at our request, action upon the contract of July 6, 1917, between the United States and the said company for the irrigation of the east side mesa lands, Imperial County, Calif, it was stated: "As you are aware, there have been extensive negotiations and conferences with representatives of the Imperial Valley irrigation district with a view to a connection with the Laguna dam and the construction of an all-American canal for the irrigation of the lands in the Imperial irrigation district, and to that end a tentative contract has been drafted and submitted to the Imperil irrigation district. It is apparent that construction and operation under both of these contracts can not proceed independently. Mr. Holt, the representative of the district, repeatedly represented to the department that he is favorably disposed toward inclusion of the mesa lands, or a part thereof in the irrigation district, and of making provision for the reclamation of such lands with a view to decreasing the cost per acre of all lands to be reclaimed through an all-American canal It has become more and more apparent in the course of these negotiations that an all-American canal is an extensive and expensive proposition, in the construction of which all interests that may possibly be benefited thereby should cooperate and contribute, and the department is favor ably disposed toward working out some feasible plan of accomplishing this object. "The Reclamation Service is now, in cooperation with the Imperial irrigation district, making a survey with a view to determining the feasibility of an allAmerican canal. To require you to proceed at this time under alternative "a" might result in a useless duplication of work. Under the circumstances, therefore, it is deemed advisable at this time not to take action under either alternative "a" or "b," but rather to grant your request for more time by suspending further action at the present. This will give an opportunity to consider the results of the surveys and investigations now in progress and will also afford your company and the people of the Imperial irrigation district an opportunity to consider further the advisability and ways and means of bringing in the mesa lands.'' Following these suggestions, the Imperial-Laguna Water Co. continuously endeavored to cooperate with the Imperial irrigation district, Coachella Valley County water district, and the west side irrigation district, and to that end all the above-named interests had their representatives in Washington and a bill satisfactory to all was prepared and introduced by Hon. William Kettner (H. R. 6044), and on June 19, 1919, said bill was referred to the Secretary of the Interior for report. July 3, 1919, the Secretary of the Interior reported upon said measure favorably, stating, among other things, that— "The provisions of the bill covering the details of this procedure have been carefully worked out and it is believed will be found practicable in application to the conditions. "The proposition involved in this bill has had consideration of this department for a number of years, and the gravity of the situation has long been recognized as one which must necessarily be met as soon as practicable. "In my opinion this bill as amended presents a satisfactory and feasible method of working out the problem, and I therefore suggest favorable action thereon." Since said report of the Secretary of the Interior was received by the House Committee on Irrigation of Arid Lands interests foreign to Imperial Valley have requested certain amendments to the bill H. R. 6044, which amendments, if adopted, might be claimed to prevent the carrying out of the provisions of the aforesaid contract between the United States and the Imperial-Laguna Water Co. A redraft of the bill (H. R. 6044), containing the proposed amendments will, we are informed, soon be presented to the Secretary of the Interior for report, and in order that the interest and investments of the Imperial-Laguna Water Co. under said contract may be fully protected (yet not desiring to do anything that may bring about delay or interfere with legislation) we respectfully make the following suggestions with the approval of all the interests above referred to for the purpose of providing a means whereby the stockholders of the Imperial-Laguna Water Co. will be able, without conflicting with the State settlement or soldiers' preference right plans, to acquire a sufficient portion of said mesa lands covered by the said contract to enable them to reimburse themselves for their outlay. We desire to call attention to the fact that the Imperial-Laguna Water Co. is a mutual water company, a nonprofit organization, and not a private corporation operating for profit. It is exactly the same character of corporation as the other 13 or 14 mutual water companies now operating in Imperial Valley. The matter of an adjustment in the light of the new elements entering into the situation has been discussed by the representatives of the Imperial irrigation district and the other organizations, including the representatives of the State of California and the American Legion (the two latter being the foreign interests referred to), and also Representative William Kettner, representing the congressional district in which the lands affected are located, and a conclusion reached that if the adjustment hereinafter suggested receives the sanction of the department it will meet the situation, will be satisfactory to them, and that they will, if requested, so state to the Secretary of the Interior. We therefore respectfully suggest the following adjustment to meet a situation newly arisen, due solely to the soldiers' settlement agitation and the desire of the State of California to acquire 50,000 acres of land in Imperial Valley for State settlement purposes: The Imperial-Laguna Water Co. to surrender its said contract with the United States of date July 6, 1917, excepting as to the lands hereinafter described, or to surrender its entire contract and to immediately enter into a new contract covering only the lands hereinafter described. The Imperial-Laguna Water Co. to withdraw its application for certain rights of way filed under the act of March 3, 1891, Los Angeles Serial No. 027026. The Imperial-Laguna Water Co. to limit the location of its stock to lands in township 16 south, range 17 east, fractional township 17 south, range 17 east, and a fractional portion of township 17 south, range 18 east, S. B. M., containing approximately 23,000 acres of irrigable land. The adoption of the above suggestions would open the way to deal with the soldiers and the State Land Settlement Board of California, if it is the desire of the department to do this, and at the same time would permit the ImperialLaguna Water Co. to come out whole. Under the adjustment the company would be limited in its activities to about one-tenth of the amount of land covered by its original contract with the United States. In other words, it would be releasing approximately 200,000 acres from the provisions of its contract, but would be enabled, nevertheless, to reimburse its stockholders for their outlay, amounting to approximately $50,000, expended in good faith during the past six years in their efforts to bring about the irrigation of the east side mesa lands. We submit herewith a rough plat of the particular lands to which the suggestions refer. If the suggestions meet the approval of the Secretary of the Interior, we will be pleased to take up with the department the details of adjustment to meet the situation. Yours, respectfully, MARK ROSE, President Imperial-Laguna Water Co. The CHAIRMAN. What was the date of that letter? The CHAIRMAN. Addressed to whom? Mr. GATES. Addressed to the Secretary of the Interior by Mr. Mark Rose and myself. The quotation commencing on the first page of our letter is from a letter addressed by the department to us April 16, 1918, postponing, at our request, action upon the contract with the Imperial Laguna Water Co., copy of which contract will be inserted in the record. The land referred to in our said letter as being covered by the contract is this land [indicating on blue print]. The CHAIRMAN. You mean the mesa land? Mr. GATES. Yes, sir; this is the East Side mesa land. That is covered by the contract. Our letter of December 24, 1919, to the Secretary of the Interior was written in order to meet a new situation which had arisen because of the request of the American Legion for a preference right, as set forth in the bill now under consideration (H. R. 11553), and the desire of the State of California to obtain 50,000 acres of land under said bill for soldier-settlement purposes. In our said letter we agreed to release from the provisions of the contract approximately nine-tenths of the land covered thereby if it were the desire of the department to favor such soldier preference right and to allow the State to obtain the 50,000 acres for soldier-settlement purposes. This offer, if accepted, would leave the land shown in yellow on this blue print to be irrigated by means of the Imperial Laguna Water Co. In other words, instead of irrigating more than 200,000 acres of land, the company would be restricted in its operations to approximately 23,000 acres of irrigable land. Mr. SMITH of Idaho. You say "release" it. What claim has Mr. Rose to what is covered there? Mr. GATES. All of this East Side mesa land, Mr. Smith, is covered by the Rose contract. Mr. SMITH of Idaho. You mean to curtail the contract to the extent of that? Mr. GATES. Yes, sir. One of the main questions before this committee to-day is whether or not this land that is embraced in this contract is in such a condition that Congress can now deal with it without taking care in some way of Mr. Rose's contract. |