harbour or at sea, was a free man ?—At sea, certainly, but not in harbour.

344. You, I think, commanded the "London" for 18 months?—Yes.

345. During the whole of that period she was in the territorial waters of Zanzibar ?-Yes.

346. She never left ?-She never left.

347. During that time did any fugitive slaves come on board?-Only the one that I have mentioned, who was a domestic slave.

348. I think that you have been asked your opinion as to whether, supposing that these orders and instructions had not come out, you think that many of the domestic slaves of Zanzibar would have taken advantage of your presence, and would have come on board, and I think that your answer was, "No"?— Yes; I do not think that the instructions assisted me there in any way. I do not recollect my attention being drawn to them.

349. Previously to these instructions, do you know that a great many of our ships were constantly at anchor in Zanzibar harbour, your ship, and my own ship, and others ?—Yes.

350. There would, therefore, have been plenty of opportunities for domestic slaves to come on board if they had thought proper to do so; but so far as you know none came?-I recollect the case in the "Pantaloon" of one coming on board, but we got out of it in this way: that the Arab master represented to the Consul that the man had stolen something from him, so we delivered him to the Consul.

351. As to allowing domestic slaves to be taken to sea, do you think that a slave trade will spring up under the shelter of that law. The law now says that people may take their domestic slaves to sea for the duties of domestic slaves, or for navigating the dhows, and no vessel can be condemned solely for Do you having those domestic slaves on board. think that a slave trade will spring up under cover

of that law?-It has sprung up under the cover of I took a vessel that law, and to a very great extent. with 50 women in it six months ago. There was a very extraordinary decision on the part of the lawyers. I believe that it was confidentially communicated to the consuls out there. To Dr. Kirk it did not matter so much, but they were more inexperienced than he was. It involved an obligation on the officer, or captor, to prove that the slave was on board for the purpose of being sold. The naval officers found this out, and pointed it out to Dr. Kirk, and I think that I wrote on the subject to the commander-in-chief, and that rule was altered. I believe that the lawyers were divided, and that a casting opinion was given by Dr. Kirk on the subject; however, the rule was altered afterwards. I captured a dhow with 50 women in it and two children; the children said that they had been taken on board, and did not know where they were to be taken to. One woman said that she had been brought on board against her will, but did not know where she was going. The other women who had been slaves for a considerable time, and probably had been sold and transferred to some other place, said, "Oh, yes, we are domestic slaves," and they declared that they were domestic slaves, but it was plain that these women were not domestic slaves, and that they were about to be sold. We could not prove that they were about to be sold, and the dhow was not condemned.

352. (Chairman.) What did you do with them ?— We had to let them go.

353. The whole 50 ?-Yes; the dhow was liberated. This was at Zanzibar.

354. (Sir Leopold Heath.) Is Captain Elton still the political agent out there ?—Yes, he is at Mosambique.

355. Did he not make official reports of the number of slaves that were being carried coastwise directly Sir Bartle Frere's treaty was signed ?-Yes, there is a blue book account of it.

vessels.

364. Did you see anything of their treatment ?— I may say that during the whole time that I was magistrate at Bushire and Karrack, I scarcely remember an instance of any slave coming to claim his freedom. We proclaimed that all slaves brought there were entitled to claim their freedom. The harbour of Bushire was filled with native vessels from other ports of the Gulf, but there was not one single instance of any slave coming before me as magistrate to ask that he might have his liberty.

365. Were they employed at all in the pearl fishery, of which we have heard a good deal?—No, I do not think that at that time there was any such thing as the negroes being employed in the pearl fishery. The boats employed in the pearl fishery belong to the Island of Bahrein, where it is an entirely maritime population. There was always a ship of war of the Indian Navy on the pearl banks during the whole period of the pearl fishery, to prevent disputes between the different boats; and I have never heard of any slaves coming from these pearl fishing boats to claim the protection of the English ship.

366. Then it would seem from your information that on the shore of the Persian Gulf the slaves were not ill-treated generally, as they did not fly to you for refuge? The only instance which I had personally of a slave coming to me, claiming the protection of a British officer, was on the Island of Bassidore in the Persian Gulf. I was there with only two other officers; there was no English ship in the neighbourhood, and a slave one day ran into my tent and fell down and clasped my knee. Both his arms were quite raw to the bone; the flesh had been cut away where he had been bound. I gave him protection, and a few days afterwards the chief of the tribe to which the man belonged sent one of his chief officers

11 Mar. 1876.

to demand that this man should be given up. I took up a rhinoceros hide whip which happened to be on the table, and I gave him a very severe thrashing, and told him to go to his master and tell him that he would have the same treatment if he came with an impertinent message, and nobody claimed the man after that.

367-8. What did you do with the slave ?-A ship bearing the British flag came in soon afterwards, and they shipped him as a seaman, and kept him on board as a sailor.

369. That is the only instance which you have had? That is the only instance; but I should like to add, that I do not think that there can be any legal status of slavery in any part of the Persian Gulf, because all the chiefs, without exception, of the maritime states of the Gulf, and the coast of Arabia, have had treaties with the British Government since the year 1822, by which they all declare the slave trade to be piracy, and give authority to our ships of war to seize and treat as pirates, any of their vessels found with negro slaves on board.

370. Quite so, but still that does not affect the slaves on shore ?-The slaves on shore can only have become slaves through evading our men-of-war by an act of piracy. These parties never harbour and breed their own slaves, if they bore children they would not be born slaves. The negro slaves must have been introduced into those countries in violation of our treaties.

371. (Sir Henry Holland.) The children would be born slaves if domestic slavery is not illegal, and that is the effect of the treaties?—There is no legal status of slavery in Persia in particular, the only slave there is merely a servant.

372. (Sir George Campbell.) Are slaves not bought and sold in Persia ?-I think not. I have never heard of any being bought and sold unless they are newly imported ones; those newly imported of course are bought and sold; but that is not the case where they have been adopted by a family and form a part of the family, as they always do.

373. (Mr. Rothery.) Is not the child of a slave girl free ?-Yes, in Persia.

374. And in Arabia ?-And in Arabia too. These Mahomedan States of the Gulf only recognise the mild domestic slavery which we read of in the Old Testament. The actual making a human being a slave in the market is entirely illegal, and has always been carried on in spite of the treaties.

375. (Chairman.) Do you think that there was much sale of slaves along the shore of the Persian Gulf? Very considerable; they were then taken. chiefly to Muscat, and the ports in the neighbourhood of Muscat, and from there they were sent to the coast of Persia up to Bassorah, and the Turkish territories, and also to the coast of India, a good many were sent to Kutch and Kattywar.

The men

376. Both men and women?-Yes. were employed as domestic slaves, and the women as concubines. In dhows captured at Zanzibar I found piles of letters from the various chiefs in the Gulf with minute descriptions of the sort of women who were to be bought for their harems.

377. If we liberated these women what could we do with them in car ships?-A great many were liberated at Zanzibar by the ships of war, and a great many were captured in native dhows. At first they were all landed at Zanzibar, under the protection of the consul; that was the only means of disposing of them, and I think that it was a very good means; they were in their own native country and among their friends, and they understood the language.

378. What did they do with the women in the Persian Gulf?-I do not think that any numbers were ever taken by our men-of-war in the Persian Gulf; if they were, they were sent to Bombay; there was no Admiralty Court nearer at that time.

379. If they were taken anywhere else they were sent to Zanzibar?-Yes, if taken anywhere on the coast of Africa.

380. What was done with them at Zanzibar ?—At Zanzibar they were landed, and had certificates of freedom given them, and they were under the protection of the British consul as British subjects; they all settled down and found plenty of occupation directly.

381. You were for some time resident at Zanzibar ? -For nearly four years.

382. What did you think of the state of slavery at Zanzibar?-When I first went there in 1858 I could learn nothing of it at first; my predecessor had died there, and the consulate had been shut for about 18 months. Gradually I found that very extensive slavery was going on amongst the British subjects, and I insisted on their emancipating every slave they possessed; and I think that the number amounted to between 7,000 and 8,000.

383. There were 7,000 who were in the possession of British subjects ?-Yes.

384. That is to say, people coming from India ?— Yes.

385. Did they employ them in cultivation ?—Yes, very largely; one man would perhaps be the owner of 400 slaves employed in plantations.

386. You insisted upon their liberating them ?— They were all liberated and registered at the consulate, and received certificates of emancipation, and they immediately found occupation. A great many of them remained with their old masters; those who had got huts and settled on plantations did so, and they made arrangements with their masters to remain as free labourers.

387. Instead of being slaves and fed, they were free and supplied with food in that way, I suppose, what was the difference ?-The arrangement which they made with the former master was to work for him three days in the week, and to have the remaining four days for themselves. In return for the three days labour, the master gave them enough land to cultivate food sufficient for themselves.

388. (Sir George Campbell.) Is there nothing of this kind in the Persian Gulf?—I think not there; there is no cultivation going on of importance in the Persian Gulf.

389. (Chairman.) Have you any notion of what quantity of slaves were taken from Africa and carried across to Arabia or Persia ?-When I was at Zanzibar those who paid duty to the Custom House were about 19,000 annually.

390. That was up to what time ?-1862. Besides that number the Sultan's family imported about 5,000, they did not pay any duty, and those were not included in the number that passed the Custom House.

A

391. (Sir George Campbell.) Where did the 19,000 go to?-All up the North and Arabian coast. great many went opposite to the ports in the Gulf of Aden, a great many to the Red Sea, and a great many to Egypt. The slave trade up the Red Sea has been very much increasing. When I came home from Zanzibar in 1862, I reported that I had found many recently imported African slaves at Suez who could speak nothing but the Suaheli language.

392. (Sir Henry Holland.) We have heard that the Sultan of Zanzibar cannot carry out his treaty. Do you know whether the same observation applies to the Makullah treaty-can that be kept?—I think that none of these Arab chiefs will attend to the treaties unless they know that they are sharply watched by a British man-of-war.

393. In fact when we have made a treaty we have to keep them up to it ?—Yes.

394. (Chairman.) When were you at Zanzibar ?— In 1862.

395. You have not been there since ?-No.

396. You have not seen the effect of the late treaty? No. After that time I was employed in Kutch. The port of Bhooj is the chief emporium for all the trade of India from the East coast of Africa, so that at a certain season the men come there from Zanzibar; and a great many men that I had emancipated recognized me and showed me

their certificates of emancipation which I had given them. I used to proclaim to all the slaves: "You are free and can claim your freedom," but not a single man did so. I am speaking now of the crews of the vessels employed in the trade of East Africa..

397. (Sir George Campbell.) What becomes of those men who are sold in India? They are sold in all the towns, Kattywar and Kutch are full of these African slaves.

398. What do they use them for ?-As domestic slaves; the women are used as concubines.

399. (Chairman.) But as I understand you they did not wish to go away?-Not those employed in vessels. I mention this because I do not see that any difficulty can arise from any number of slaves coming on board Her Majesty's ships to claim their freedom-it would only be in a case of atrocious cruelty, or where a woman has been subject to gross cruelty-otherwise I do not think that any difficulty could arise. The few instances which will ever happen of a slave coming on board a man-of-war to claim his freedom, I believe, will always be where his life is in danger.

400. (Sir Henry Holland.) Supposing that before an English man-of-war went to Zanzibar it was proclaimed that the officers would not entice fugitive slaves on board, but that it must be understood that if a slave did escape and come on board he could not be returned, do you think that if that was known in Zanzibar there would be a great number of fugitive slaves? I think that there would be very few. There would be a few who had been recently imported in violation of the treaty, but a slave who had once settled down in an Arab family, unless his life was in danger, would not seek to escape.

401. You do not anticipate that there would be any rush of fugitive slaves if such a proclamation were made?-No.

402. (Sir George Campbell.) In Zanzibar do they make them all Mahommedans?—No, not always; when they are taken young they do.

403. In the Gulf do they do so?-I do not know. When they are once landed there I do not know that they care what they are.

404. A slave would be much better treated as a Mahommedan ?—Yes.

405. (Mr. Mountague Bernard.) A slave on board a fishing boat would be very unlikely to go on board a man-of-war?-Very. I have never found an instance of it in Bombay.

406. (Sir Henry Holland.) Are they all slaves ?—Yes.

407. They are used for the purpose of coaling and bringing provisions on board, and they never claim their freedom?-Just so.

408. (Sir Leopold Heath.) Do you remember that eight years ago official communications were made to the Governor of Bombay, stating that there were a great many dhows in the harbour with slaves, and that an official investigation took place which resulted in reporting (I will not say proving) that that was not the case?-I quite remember that, and I also know positively that a great number of slaves are so taken to Bombay and sold in Bombay, and taken into the interior. After seeing that, I asked Colonel Hodgson, who is now at home, and who was the superintendent of police of a district close to the city of Bombay, about it; he said that his men constantly reported the same thing to him. I had a small boy emancipated whom I brought home and put to school, and I took him back to Bombay, and he constantly said to me that he saw recently imported slaves there.

409. (Chairman.) Those slaves could claim their freedom if they liked ?-Not the women, because they are veiled and cannot speak to anybody, and the boys are carried off to the Mahommedan cities in the interior before they have sufficient knowledge to become aware that they would be free. Another difficulty is that you never meet with anyone in India who can speak the Suaheli language.

410. (Sir Leopold Heath.) Do you think that if the carrying of domestic slaves as a part of the crew were forbidden, the trade would be hampered for want of seamen, or are there sufficient freemen to man all the dhows which frequent Zanzibar ?—I should like to explain that this term of "domestic slaves" has only arisen since the new treaty, and the new regulations have come into force. I do not quite know what the effect of it will be in any treatics that we can make. There was no such provision under the old treaty of 1845, that domestic slaves were distinguished from any other slaves. If a vessel had slaves on board, whether they were domestic slaves or freshly imported slaves, the vessel was liable to seizure for it; it is a new term.

411. (Sir George Campbell.) That was under the treaty of 1845 ?—Yes.

412. (Sir Leopold Heath.) And also under the Admiralty Instructions ?-Yes.

413. (Chairman.) Then you think that making any marked distinction between slaves is a misimpression that what are called domestic slaves are not take?--Yes. Admiral Cumming seems to be under the sold or taken away. One vessel which I boarded with Captain Oldfield, who commanded the "Lyra" at Zanzibar, had 102 girls on board, she was just going to sail; the women had all been selected for their youth and good looks, to be sold at high prices in Arabia; they had most of them a certain amount of education, and what the Arabs would call accomplishments; they had been taught singing and dancing.

414. (Sir George Campbell.) Were they Arabs or Negresses?-Negresses. Those 102 females were in Zanzibar Harbour. When they were taken out of the vessel sailors were sent in to take out their provisions, and every man who went into the hold fainted immediately. The doctor said that it would cause some epidemic, and the vessel was towed out to sea and scuttled. There is no doubt that if that vessel had sailed from the harbour of Zanzibar with those 102 females on board, not one woman would have been alive. She was going up to the coast of Arabia. That is a case where they sell concubines to Arabs; they keep them for two, three, or four years, and when they get tired of them they sell them to other Arabs. A common thing in Zanzibar is for a man to go into the market and buy a number of girls and keep them as concubines for 10 or 12 months, and then he resells them.

415. (Chairman.) What happened to these 100 girls? They all went to the Seychelles? I afterwards saw them nicely dressed, some were going to church, and they were looking as happy as possible. They were all handed over, and attended to under the superintendence of the Commissioner of Police. 416. (Sir Henry Holland.) In what year was that? -In 1861.

417. From what you saw there, do you think that the slaves who were brought there were badly treated ?--Quite the reverse.

418. (Sir George Campbell.) You mean in the Seychelles ?-In the Seychelles. Another thing is, that it is a climate which exactly suits them, and they get the food to which they have been accustomed, namely, cassava.

THE RIGHT HON. SIR ROBERT J. PHILLIMORE, D.C.L.

THE RIGHT HON. MOUNTAGUE BERNARD, D.C.L. SIR HENRY T. HOLLAND, BART., C.M.G., M.P.

ADMIRAL THE HON. SIR FREDERICK 419. (Chairman.) Will you state at what period you were in command at the Cape?-I was in command at the Cape from May 1857 to July 1860.

420. Your command at that time extended to the east coast of Africa as well as the west ?—Yes.

421. How far did it extend over the east coast ?— It took in all the Portuguese possessions on the east coast to Cape Delgado.

422. Which is nearly opposite the northern point of Madagascar ?—Yes; and Madagascar was in my station, and Mauritius, and the Island of Johanna.

423. (Sir Robert Phillimore.) Madagascar was the furthest point north ?—Yes.

424. (Chairman.) During that time had you, or the captains under you, any experience of fugitive slaves coming on board any of the vessels of the Royal Navy?-None; I have looked back to the records of the station during the whole time, and I cannot find a single official letter upon that subject.

425. You had several vessels employed in preventing the slave trade ?—Yes, very actively employed on both sides. The slave trade was at that time very active; there was one officer in particular on the east coast, namely, Captain Oldfield, who was most zealous and most active in cruising against the slavers, and he captured a good many slave vessels.

426. You went, I suppose, into different ports in Madagascar, and on the opposite side, Mozambique ? -I went to Tamatave and to Johanna and to Mozambique; those were the three ports which I visited in that particular locality.

427. On those occasions did you see anything of the slave trade?—No; I saw a great many slaves at Mozambique, but they were chiefly domestic slaves. I saw slaves upon the plantations there in large numbers, and a more degraded or miserable set I never saw in my life anywhere.

428. But none of them attempted to escape to the ships?-None. Besides having looked back to official records, I cannot recall to recollection any instance.

66

429. Did you on any occasion go up further north, to Aden or near there?-When I commanded the Endymion" I was senior officer at Bombay, and I went to the Persian Gulf. One of the instructions which I had at that time was to go to a place called Shargah, and reclaim from the Sheik of that port some slaves who had been carried off into captivity from Berbera, a place on the coast opposite Aden. I did So. I had with me as an interpreter a very intelligent officer of the Indian Navy; and when I got to Shargah I claimed those slaves, and got back four women.

430. Were they negro women ?-Not negroes, they were Somalis; they are not the black negroes -they are rather a good-looking race of people. After they were on board I asked this lieutenant of the Indian Navy, who spoke their language, to get their histories from them, and it appeared upon inquiry that every one of them had been sent away with her own consent; they had been sold by their relations with their own consent, and they were very sorry indeed to go back again.

431. However, you took them back ?-I took them back to Berbera, and when I got there the first thing that I found was that the place was full of slaves

REAR-ADMIRAL SIR LEOPOLD HEATH, K.C.B.
SIR HENRY J. S. MAINE, K.C.S.I., D.C.L.
SIR GEORGE CAMPBELL, K.C.S.I., M.P.
HENRY C. ROTHERY, ESQ.

HENRY HOWARD, Esq., C.B., Secretary.

W. GREY, G.C.B., R.N., examined.

waiting for shipment to the Persian Gulf. I landed the women there in obedience to my instructions; what became of them afterwards of course I have no means of knowing. The Somalis are a very fine race of people, but I was forced to be very cautious in what I said to the Somali chief in delivering these people to him; I did not allude to the question of slavery, but I said we had heard that they had been carried off, and that we were anxious to show our goodwill by restoring them to their country.

432. (Mr. Mountague Bernard.) These were women of his own race?—Yes; that is the only instance in which I have had anything to do with slaves.

433. (Chairman.) Did you see much of the slavers, and slave trading vessels, when you were in the Persian Gulf?--I do not remember seeing any slavery in the Persian Gulf.

434. (Sir Henry Holland.) A good many slavers were captured during the time of your command?—A great many.

435. What was generally done with the slaves who were captured; were they taken to the Seychelles ?— All on the west coast were taken to Sierra Leone or St. Helena, and those on the east coast were taken to the Seychelles; but it very seldom happened that the dhows that were captured were seaworthy, and generally the slaves had to be taken on board. In a great many cases they were run on shore, and a great many of the slaves were drowned.

436. (Sir Robert Phillimore.) Have you formed any opinion as to what could be done with slaves if they were captured in great quantities; where they could be sent to ?-I do not know of any other way of disposing of them but sending them to one of the stations where you have liberated Africans, and trying to provide for them in the best way that you can.

437. Have you ever been at Liberia yourself ?--I have. I passed two days there. The president and vice-president were absent at the time; I was very much struck with the schools in Liberia, and the pains that were taken to teach the children. I did not, however, form a very favourable opinion of the character of the grown-up liberated Africans, they seemed to be very idle and very listless.

438. (Chairman.) When they are taken to the Seychelles they are put under a sort of limited slavery; they are put under apprenticeship, are they not? - Yes. Formerly at Sierra Leone the West Indian regiments used to be recruited from them. 439. I was rather adverting to the east coast, and to the Seychelles?-I was never there; there was an establishment there for them, and I hardly know what was done with them afterwards.

440. (Sir Leopold Heath.) From what you have seen do you suppose that, in the event of England determining to carry out the doctrine that slaves are freed on coming on board a man-of-war, if captains gave out that they would not entice people, but would do their best to keep them away and so on, there would be any great rush of slaves on board a man-ofwar at any of the places with which you are acquainted; would there be any large number taking advantage of this free spot in the harbour?-That is so entirely a matter of opinion that I hardly know how to answer the question. My own opinion is that it would be

very injudicious to hold out the expectation that slaves would be received on board our ships. I think that it would lead to very difficult questions and complications which formerly did not arise.

441. I wish to know what you think the slaves would do supposing that that were the rule?—I really have no means of judging.

442. (Mr. Rothery.) I understand you to say that you would think it very injudicious to hold out any such inducements?-Certainly.

443. When you were in a neutral port, if a slave had come on board your ship while you were in command, what would you have done ?-My opinion upon that point is this: if, as captain of a ship, I went into the harbour of Rio de Janeiro, where all the work was done by slaves, if a boat with supplies, or with coal, came alongside, I should give positive orders to the officers not to allow any of the men from the boats to come on board, and if any did come on board surreptitiously I should order them to be sent back into their boat directly.

444. (Mr. Mountague Bernard.) With respect to the plantations at Mozambique, to whom do they belong, to the Portuguese, or the Arabs ?-The plantations that I particularly went to were on the mainland opposite, and belonged to a Mr. Suarez, a Portuguese, who is well known to all the captains upon that coast, and who owns rather extensive plantations, and is, I

452. (Chairman.) You were, I think, at one time Acting Magistrate in the Seychelles?-I was the Acting District Judge for four months in the year before last. I had a permanent appointment in Mauritius, and I went over to replace the judge at Seychelles for four months; as the judge wanted leave of absence.

453. During the time that you were at the Seychelles, you had an opportunity of seeing something of the slaves who were landed there ?--I saw slaves landed three or four times during the time I was there; slaves brought in by the men-of-war and landed there.

454. How were they dealt with when they came ?-When they first arrived they were taken charge of by the Government, fed, clothed, and taken care of for a certain number of days, according to the condition they were in, and they were then allotted to the planters or the proprietors in the island.

455. What are the terms of their allotment; are they allotted for a particular period?-So far as I remember they entered into a contract of service for a period of five years, much in the same manner as the immigrants who arrive in Mauritius from India.

456. Like the Coolies ?--Like the Coolies. The contracts between them and the masters are passed before the district judge, and the conditions of the contract are explained to them by means of an interpreter.

457. Have they room in the Seychelles to take any number of slaves?-Yes; they are in want of labour in the Seychelles and when a cargo of slaves arrives the applications are very numerous for them.

458. Both for the men and the women ?-More for the men than for the women; but I think that all the cargoes which arrived whilst I was there were very soon allotted. There was no difficulty in getting rid of either the men or the women, but, of course, the planters prefer having the men to the women.

459. (Sir Robert Phillimore.) Was that in any particular season?-It was from the end of June until the middle of October.

460. Do they grow cloves in the Seychelles?-The chief product of the island is cocoanut, and they now grow vanilla to a small extent.

461. (Chairman.) Did the slaves seem contented with their position?-They appeared to be so whilst they were under the charge of the government. They were well fed, and seemed very happy, and the nature of the contract was explained to them. I cannot

exactly say how they felt after they had entered into the contracts with their employers, but I know that they were perfectly well aware of their rights, because when they had any complaint to make against their employers they knew how to find their way to the court house, and I know that some of them came within a week or a fortnight of their allotment to make complaints against their employers for not being properly treated, or properly fed; I had to examine into the complaints which they made, and to decide upon them. The complaints, I may say, were not numerous, but there were instances in which a very short time elapsed after their allotment before the Africans came down to complain.

462. Before that time you were in Mauritius ?— I was magistrate in Mauritius.

463. (Sir Robert Phillimore.) At what date were you in the Seychelles ?-I went in June 1874, and returned to Mauritius in the following October.

464. (Chairman.) Did you see anything of slavery in Mauritius, did any slaves come from Madagascar? No, I never saw a slave land in Mauritius; I never saw what might be termed a liberated African landed whilst I was there, and I believe that, for several years previous to that time, no liberated African had been landed in Mauritius.

465. (Sir Robert Phillimore.) Is it your opinion that the Seychelles could employ a greater number of slaves than have yet been imported there?--I think that work could be found for more than I saw landed there.

466. What sort of number do you think could be taken ?-I can form no opinion as to the number which might be required.

467. (Sir Henry Holland.) Is not the condition of the island improving ?-Yes.

468. More land is now put under culture than there used to be?—Yes. What are now required are more hands to work.

469. (Mr. Rothery.) Are you aware that at one time they asked not to have any more sent to them-. that was before your time?—I am not aware of that. I heard no complaints of too many landing whilst I was there.

470. (Sir Henry Holland.) Had you opportunities of observing the general state of the slaves after they had been allotted to the masters in the Seychelles?—