Stanley, Lord (Lancs.) Vincent, Col. SirC. EH (Sheffield Wortley, Rt. Hn. C. B. Stuart TELLERS FOR THE AYES- | NOES. | Hayter, Rt Hon Sir Arthur D. Lawson, Sir Wilfrid (Cornwall MacVeagh, Jeremiah Nolan, Joseph (Louth, S.) EVENING SITTING STANDING ORDERS. *THE CHAIRMAN OF COMMITTEES (Mr. J. W. LOWTHER, Cumberland, Penrith) said the period of the session had arrived when the House should consider the Standing Orders for private business, and to make such alterations in them as might be necessary. The list of Amendments which appeared on the Paper was a long one, but he thought there was nothing controversial in it, or anything that need detain the House Last year a Committee was appointed to consider this question with a view to such alteration of the Standing Orders as might be desirable in the interests of efficiency, economy, and general convenience. hat Committee had made a great many recom mendations and the Amendments which he had put down on the Paper were to Price, Robert John Redmond, William (Clare) Taylor, Theodore C. (Radcliffe TELLERS FOR THE NOES- carry out some of those recommendations. Others it was impossib'e to carry out without legislation. He thought the better way would be to make a short explanatory statement with regard to each Amendment before the Question was put from the Chair. He moved to amend Standing Order 29 in order to provide that in parishes which had no parish council the promoters of any Bill affecting matters within the parish should deposit such plans as might be required by Standing Orders with the chairman of the parish meeting, in order that he might be informed as to how his parish might be affected. LORD EDMUND FITZMAURICE (Wiltshire, Cricklade): Thought that this would be a great improvement to small parishes, which at the present time were put to great disadvantage in regard to Private Bills At the same time he moved that the best plan would be to get these Small parishes to merge with their larger neighbours. He supported the Amend ment. Standing Order 29, relating to Private Bu-ine-s, read, and amended, “in paragraph (D), by inserting in line 2, after the words Parish Council, the words with the chir man of the parish meeting and.'"-(The Chairman of Ways and Means.) *MR. J. W. LOWTHER said the next Amendment was destined to carry out the recommendations of the Committee. to substitute December 17 for December 21 as the date for depositing Petitions for Private Bills in the House. H said December 17 was the date in the House of Lords. no MR. WHITLEY (Halifax) saw reason why the date for the House of Commons and for the House of Lords should not be the same, but suggested that it would be perhaps better to make the date the 21st. There was a great difficulty very often in getting municipal Bills ready as early as the 17th. The elections took place on the 1st November and the councils met for the first time on the 9th, and the right hon. Gentleman would quite appreciate the fact that the Committees had to be got into working order, and it was very often difficult to get a Bill ready by the 17th. Of course he would not press the matter against the convenience of the public departments, but municipal corporations promoted a great many Bills in this House, and he thought this small advantage should be given them. SIR CHARLES RENSHAW (Renfrewshire, W.) expressed surprise at the view taken by the Member opposite, who seemed to forget that notice of all these Bills had to be given in the month of November. The date they proposed to fix now did not, therefore, affect the question, so far as the municipality was concerned, of the elections or the duties of the Committees. He believed the proposed Amendment would have a most beneficial effect. Standing Order 32 read, and amended, "in line 5, by leaving out the word 21st,' and inserting the word 17th.""(The Chairman of Ways and Means.) *MR. J. W. LOWTHER said the next Amendment was designed, like the last, to get the promoters to get on with their work. The object was to compel promoters of Bills to hold the Wharncliffe meeting within a reasonable period after the result would be that the Committees the First Reading of the Bill. He hoped would be able to commence work at an earlier period of the session than had been the case hitherto. Standing Order 62 read, and amended, "in line 2, by leaving out the words after the first reading thereof,' and inserting the words 'within five weeks of the date on which the Petition for the same was endorsed by the Examiner.'"-(The Chairman of Ways and Means.) *MR. J. W. LOWTHER said the next three Amendments were really only in order to bring the Standing Orders into accordance with the existing course of procedure. If accepted it would permit the counsel for Mr. Speaker to take counsel with the learned Chairman and his counsel as to the division of the Bills. They had also defined a date, the 28th January, for the drawing of Bills which had hitherto taken place on the first day of the session. Standing Order 79 read, and amended, “in line 1, after the word Means,' by inserting the words or the Counsel to Mr. Speaker,' and by leaving out the words at the commencement of each session,' and inserting the words 'on or before the 28th day of January, in each year."(The Chairman of Ways and Means.) " In line 3, by inserting after the word 'Lords,' the words or with his Counsel.'"(The Chairman of Ways and Means) *MR. J. W. LOWTHER said the next Amendment carried the recommendation of the Committee, and designed to slightly reconstruct the Court of Referees. Under the present order the number of the Court of Referees was three. Mr. Speaker as a fact appointed seven, and this proposal was to bring the Standing Orders in accordance with the facts. MR. WHITLEY asked, under this proposal were the duties to be divided Would the same persons as were on the Board of Referees be on the unopposed Bill Committee, and, if so, what distinction would be drawn before the Board? House, explained that the duties of the *MR. J. W. LOWTHER, by leave of the Board of Referees and the Committe of unopposed Private Bills were not identical. The Referees appointed by Mr. Speaker were gentlemen of great *MR. J. W. LOWTHER said: Any unopposed Bill having police and sanitary clauses would go of course to the Police and Sanitary Committee. It was not intended to interfere with that. He quite agreed that the practice in these matters should be uniform. the line 2, by leaving out from the word 'them,' Standing Order 109 read and amended, "In to the end of the Standing Order, and inserting to the Committee on Unopposed Bills, which shall be composed of five MemMeans (who when present shall be ex-officio bers, namely, the Chairman of Ways and Chairman of every such Committee), Deputy Chairman, two Members from time to time selected by the Chairman of Ways and Committee of Selection at the commencement Means from a panel to be appointed by the of every session, and counsel to Mr. Speaker, and three shall be the quorum thereof.' '--(The Chairman of Ways and Means.) legal ability, who considered strict Committee and the Unopposed Bill questions of law, and all this amend- Committee worked on different lines. ment proposed was to enlarge the Court. of Referees chiefly because in the past there had been difficulty in obtaining a quorum. The new proposal with regard to the Committee on unopposed Bills was this. At the present moment when ever the Committee was set up by the Standing Order it had to consist of the Chairman of Ways and Means, the Member whose name was on the back of the Bill, and a Member who had no interest in the matter. He had considered the recommendation of the Committee on the matter, and had thought it best to have a panel to select from. He had consulted the Chairman of the Committee of Selection on the subject, who first seemed to think it would not be possible, but subsequently came to the conclusion that it would be possible to form a panel, especially if hon. gentlemen now serving as referees would consent, if asked, to serve on the Unopposed Bill Committee. "Standing Order 87, read and repealed, Ordered that the Chairman of Ways and Means, and the Deputy Chairman, with not less than seven other persons, who shall be Members of this House, and shall be appointed by Mr. Speaker for such periods as he shall think fit, shall be Referees of the House on Private Bills, and shall have the assistance of the Counsel to Mr. Speaker; such Referees to form one or more Courts, three at least to be required to constitute each Court."-(The Chairman of Ways and Means.) *MR. J. W. LOWTHER said the next Amendment was to leave out a Standing Order dealing with road Bills, which did not now exist, and which would therefore become obsolete. Standing Order 110, read, and repealed. — (The Chairman of Ways and Means.) *MR. J. W. LOWTHER said the next was a novel one; the idea was that they might save a little time by compelling all petitions to be deposited on or Ordered, That this Order be a Stand- before 12th February. ing Order of this House. *Mr. J. W. LOWTHER said the next Amendment was simply to bring the Standing Order in accord with the fact. He begged to move. Standing Order 98 read and amended, “In line 3, by leaving out the word seven' and inserting the word 'ten.'”—(The Chairman of Ways and Means.) *MR. J. W. LOWTHER: The next he had already explained in reply to the hon. Member for Halifax. MR. WHITLEY agreed that it was extremely desirable to improve the method of dealing with unopposed standing Bills. All he desired to suggest was that some method should be found to co-ordinate the work. It would be unfortunate if the Police and Sanitary Mr. J. W. Lowther, Standing Order 129, read and amended, "In line 6, by leaving out the words, not later than ten clear days after the First Reading of such Bill,' and inserting the words on or before the 12th day of February,' and at the end of the Standing Order to add the words, Provided that in the case of, (a) any Bill brought from the House of Lords; and (b) any Bill as to which compliance with the Standing has been dispensed with; and (c) any Bill proOrder as to the time for depositing the Bill moted by the London County Council introduced under Standing Order 194; a petition against the Bill may be deposited at any time not later than ten clear days after the First Reading of the Bill."-(The Chairman of Ways and Means.) *MR. J. W. LOWTHER said the next Amendment was also a new proposal, recommended by the Select Committee last year in order to obviate a difficulty in which they found themselves. It was a case in which a question arose as to the rates charged for the carriage of bicycles, and the consider the question of allowing persons Cyclists' Touring Club presented a not pecuniarily interested to represent petition on the ground that the certain phases of public policy on which rate was much too high. Their locus they were entitled to be heard by reason standi was objected to, and the Court of their experience and position. of Referees decided that they had no power to give them one, because they were neither a chamber of commerce nor a chamber of agriculture nor any similar body. Seeing that the Cyclists' Touring Club represented cyclists generally, the decision was very hard upon them, but in fact their position was subsequently justified by the action of the House in striking out the excessive rates complained of and putting in reasonable ones. He begged to move. line 1, by leaving out the words 'Where a Standing Order 133A read, and amended, in chamber of commerce or agriculture or other similar body, sufficiently representing a particular trade or business,' and inserting the words Where any body of persons corporate or incorporate sufficiently representing a particular trade, business, or interest.””—(The Chairman of Ways and Means.) "In line 4, by leaving out the words 'or business,' and inserting the words business or interest."(The Chairman of Ways and Means.) *MR. J. W. LOWTHER said the next Amendment had been pressed on him by the Chairman of the County Council of the West Riding of Yorkshire, and its object was to give the Joint Committee of a Council the right to be heard. the words or being a Joint Committee of *SIR CHARLES DILKE said there had been private Bills before the House in which bodies representing in some cases employers and in other cases employed had some distinct interest, but had not found it possible to be represented, and such cases had been dealt Standing Order 134в read, and amended, in with by an Amendment of Standing Orders. That had been done in the case of the mines, but it had not been possible to do it in the case of the textile employers and employees of Lancashire, and he would suggest whether words could not be inserted to enable the representation of employers or employed in any particular trade. This matter had been considered by the by the Speaker's counsel, who was, he thought, somewhat favourable to some such alteration. *MR. J. W. LOWTHER hoped the right hon. Gentleman would not move an Amendment. The point was a controversial one, and he had deliberately refrained from raising it on this occasion. It ought to be on the Paper some little time in order to give those interested an opportunity of studying it. *SIR CHARLES DILKE said he felt the force of the appeal, but he had pointed out a case of hardship which ought to be dealt with. It was a case rather for the textile representatives, and he would not therefore move an Amend ment. MR. BRYCE hoped that when the question of amending 123 B came on, the Chairman of the Committee would *MR. J. W.LOWTHER said the object of the next Amendment was to carry out a recommendation of the Select Committee enabling a person in the occupation of a house in a street at right angles or in the immediate vicinity of a street when it was proposed to lay a tramway to have a locus standi and to appear. Standing Order 135 read. Amendment proposed "In lines 1 and 2, to leave out the words in any street,' and insert situate in or having its access materially dependent on any street or road. "(The Chairman of Ways and Means.) Question proposed, "That the words proposed to be left out stand part of the Standing Order." Mr. WHITLEY hoped the Amendment would not be pressed. Petitioners who had only a vague interest might use their powers against the promoters for the sole purpose of blackmail. It would be a very dangerous thing to enlarge the sphere of objecting frontages in that vague way. It would lead to considerably increased the necessity of sending a Bill twice expense. He hoped the right hon. Gentle- before the Examiners. men would reconsider the matter. * Mr. J. W. LOWTHER said he was not aware the Amendment would meet with opposition, and under the circum stances he would not press it. He held that the referees should have power to determine whether petitions from roundthe-corner petitioners should have a locus standi, but he was not prepared to frame the words on the spur of the moment, and he would see if later on he could bring it up in an amended form. "Standing Order 137 read and repealed.” (The Chairman of Ways and Means.) Mr. WHITLEY said he was in favour of this Amendment, but he feared that the wording would exclude from its operation municipal Bills where the promoters supplied themselves as well as other persons. * Mr. J. W. LOWTHER said the point had been carefully considered by the Board of Trade, and he did not think there would be any difficulty such as the hon. Member seemed to fear. LORD EDMUND FITZMAURICE thought the words were on the whole sufficient. This was one of the most important and valuable changes proposed, because these Electric Power Bills were increasing in number, and many difficult points had had to be dealt with in the past year. The clause would save a great deal of expense. "Ordered, That in the case of any Bill relating to the generation of electricity for supply to persons or bodies other than the promoters, the Bill shall not be reported by the Committee until a Report from the Board of Trade on the powers sought has been laid before the Committee; and the Committee shall report specially to the House in what manner the recommendations or observations in the Report of the Board of Trade, and also in what manner the Clauses of the Bill relating to the powers sought, have been dealt with by the Committee."-(The Chairman of Ways and Means.) 66 Standing Order 193 read, and amended in line 2, by leaving out the words first preing the words 'which shall be.'” sented, which shall have been duly,' and insert indorsed by one of the Examiners.' ”—(The "In line 3, by leaving out the words and Chairman of Ways and Means.) *MR. J. W. LOWTHER said this next Amendment dealt with the date before which Provisional Orders must be read a first time. At present it was fixed for the 1st June, but it sometimes happened if Whitsuntide occurred before that, to be necessary to suspend Standing Orders in order to pass a Bill. This would obviate that necessity. SIR WILLIAM TOMLINSON (Preston) suggested that it would be less ambiguous to provide that the First Reading should take place before the House rose for the Whitsuntide recess. *MR. J. W. LOWTHER dissented, and said Whitsuntide was a date which anyone could discover by looking at the calendar. Mr. WHITLEY hoped the Treasury would be induced to apply a similar provision to Money Bills. "Standing Order 193A read, and amended at end by leaving out the words the 1st day of June, and inserting the word Whitsuntide."-- (The Chairman of Ways and Means.) "Ordered, That all Private Bills shall on the day previous to the day fixed for their being laid upon the Table of the House be deposited in the Private Bill Office, and shall the Table of the House, together with a list of be laid by one of the Clerks of that Office on such Bills."(The Chairman of Ways and Means.) "Ordered, That this Order be a Standing Order of this House." "Ordered, That where the Examiner has endorsed the Petition for a Private Bill Standing Orders complied with, the Bill shall be presented by being laid upon the Table of the House not later than one clear day after such endorsement, or if when it is endorsed the House is not sitting, then not later than one clear day after the first sitting thereof subsequent to such endorsement, and if the House is not sitting on the latest day on which the "Ordered, That this Order be a Standing House, then the Bill shall be so laid on the Bill ought to be laid upon the Table of the Order of this House." *MR. J. W. LOWTHER said the next Amendment might almost be called a consequential Amendment. It would save, Mr. Whitley. first day on which the House again sits Where the Examiner has reported with respect to any Private Bill that the Standing Report has been referred to the Select Com Orders have not been complied with, and the mittee on Standing Orders, and the Select |