stated positively that they were entitled to govern themselves as they pleased, provided always that they did not act in any way to the prejudice or injury of Her Majesty's Colonies. That was the policy he laid down, and he entirely repudiated anything of a humanitarian character in the matter. The action of Her Majesty's Government was solely, expressly, and avowedly caused by the imminent danger to Her Majesty's subjects, brought about by the external policy of the Transvaal. And with regard to the Orange Free State, he most distinctly repudiated any idea that its was contem "forcible annexation " plated by the Government. On the contrary, it was the desire of Her Majesty's Government to continue those friendly relations with the Orange Free State which had characterized the intercourse between them up to the present time. The hon. Gentleman had talked of 19 or 20 clauses having been struck out of the Bill; but if the hon. Gentleman could have spared from some of his multifarious occupations time to examine the Bill more closely, he would have seen that only 13 clauses had been struck out-all, except one, being matters of the purest detail. He hoped the House would excuse him for not entering into further details. Question, "That the word 'now' stand part of the Question," put, and agreed to. Amendment proposed, In page 2, line 3, after the word "Council," to insert the words "issued within two years from the passing of this Act."-(Mr. O'Donnell.) MR. J. LOWTHER opposed the Amendment. Question, "That those words be there inserted," put, and negatived. MR. O'DONNELL proposed, in the same clause, line 5, after "legislatures," to insert "after the constituencies have been consulted." He thought that before the formation of any union the constituencies had a right to be consulted as well as the Legislature. It would not be fair to press on the people a Confederation to which they might object-particularly when the nominee element prevailed to such an extent. MR. BIGGAR seconded the Amendment. Amendment proposed, tures," to insert the words "after the constiIn page 2, line 5, after the word "Legislatuencies have been consulted."—(Mr. O'Donnell.) MR. J. LOWTHER said, that five years would not pass without an appeal to the electors in the Colonies possessing Representative Assemblies; but if the scheme were handicapped with this Amendment, it was possible that the very object in view might be defeated. MR. COURTNEY urged that the Bill as it stood would leave it possible for a Legislature to vote one way and its electors immediately after to vote another a danger which had occurred in Canada, and which it was desirable to guard against in this case. The second Main Question put, and agreed to. Bill considered. Clause 3 (Declaration of union and argument of the Under Secretary was provision for its completion). MR. O'DONNELL proposed, in page 2, line 3, after "Council," to insert "issued within two years from the passing of this Act." He said that his object was that a vague measure like this should not be left for an indefinite time to beat about the four corners of the world. In the course of five years the whole history of Europe might be changed, and the Government might be perplexed to find that they had this business of the Confederation on their hands. He hoped the Government would be able to accept the Amend ment. most remarkable, for it implied that the danger was that the constituencies would reject Confederation. He should have been glad to hear from a Member of the Cabinet some sort of reason for objecting to so Constitutional a proviso. An Order in Council might be issued before an election could take place; and he submitted that the Legislature should not have power to effect Confederation if the constituencies were opposed to it. MR. GORST said, the idea of the Under Secretary was that the electors were now in favour of confederation, and it would be a misfortune if this House were to say that their Repre sentatives should not vote for it with out subjecting the constituencies to a penal dissolution. Clause 9 (Constitution of Privy Council of the Union). MR. O'DONNELL moved an Amendment providing that all alterations in Question put, "That those words be the Members of such Privy Council there inserted." The House divided:-Ayes 18; Noes 173: Majority 155.-(Div. List, No. 296.) AYES Burt, T. Cowen, J. Gray, E. D. Jenkins, E. Barclay, J. W. Butt, I. Fawcett, H. Havelock, Sir H. Lawson, Sir W. O'Beirne, Capt. Parnell, C. S. Richard, H. Briggs, W. E. TELLERS-Mr. O'Donnell and Mr. Biggar. MR. O'DONNELL moved, in page 2, line 6, to leave out "Union" and insert "Confederation." The effect of his Amendment would be that the new Union would be called the South African Confederation," and it could not then be mixed up with the Canadian "Dominion" or the United States. Amendment proposed, in page 2, line 6, to leave out the word "Union,' and insert the word "Confederation,"(Mr. O'Donnell,)-instead thereof. MR. J. LOWTHER said, that if the word "Union were retained, it would enable the Colonies to choose either a closer or a looser title, as they might prefer the word "Union " or "Confederation." The clause gave power to Her Majesty to declare the Confederation "with name and designation as to Her Majesty may seem fit." Question, "That the word 'Union' stand part of the Bill," put, and agreed to. Clause agreed to. Clause 5 (Provinces). In page 2, line 36, before the word "The," to insert the words "Before the first assembling of the Union Parliament."-(Mr. O'Donnell.) should be effected on the advice of Ministers responsible to the Union Parliament. Amendment proposed, In page 3, line 16, after the word "general," to insert the words "always providing that such additions to and such removals from the said Privy Council shall take place by the advice of ministers responsible to the Union Parliament."-(Mr. O'Donnell.) Question, "That those words be there inserted," put, and negatived. Clause 16 (Privileges, &c., of Houses). MR. COURTNEY moved, as an Amendment, in page 4, line 30, at end, to add "And until the passing of such Act the said privileges, immunities, and powers shall be the same as those at the time of the passing of this Act held, enjoyed, and exercised by the Commons House of Parliament of the United Kingdom of Great Britain and Ireland and by the Members thereof." Amendment agreed to; words inserted accordingly. Clause, as amended, agreed to, and ordered to stand part of the Bill. Clause 19 (Constitution of House of Assembly). Amendment proposed, In page 5, line 5, after the word "Parliament," to insert the words "acting in conjunction with the Provincial Councils or Parliaments."-(Mr. O'Donnell.) inserted," put, and negatived. MR. O'DONNELL moved a proposal, Amendment proposed, In page 5, line 9, after the word "qualifications," to insert the words "and the members shall be remunerated for their services at such MR. BIGGAR supported the Amend-rates."-(Mr. O'Donnell.) ment. MR. J. LOWTHER pointed out that the sub-section of the 3rd clause rendered the Amendment unnecessary. Question, "That those words be there inserted," put, and negatived. Mr. Gorst After some observations from Mr. E. JENKINS in opposition to, and from Mr. PARNELL in support of, the Amendment, MR. J. LOWTHER opposed the Amendment on behalf of the Government. TELLERS-Mr. O'Donnell and Mr. Biggar. Clause 20 (Summoning of House of Assembly). On the Motion of Mr. O'DONNELL, Amendment made, in page 5, line 17, before "in," insert "but at least once a-year." Clause, as amended, agreed to, and ordered to stand part of the Bill. Clause 21 (Decennial re-adjustment of representation). MR. COURTNEY moved an Amendment to the effect that changes brought to light by the decennial census should operate in producing re-adjustments both in the Legislative Council and in the House of Assembly. Amendment proposed, In page 5, line 23, after the word " provinces," to insert the words "whether in the Legislative Council or in the House of Assembly."-(Mr. Courtney.) MR. J. LOWTHER pointed out that ample power was given by Clauses 33 and 56 to alter the composition of the Councils as might be thought expedient. Question, "That those words be there inserted," put, and negatived. Clause 26 (Disallowanee by Order in Council of Act assented to by Governor General). MR. O'DONNELL moved that the clause be struck out. The provisions of the clause were extremely unsatisfactory. The clause permitted that an Act passed by the Colonial Legislature, and sent home to this country, might be pigeon-holed for two years in the Colonial Office, and then be disallowed by the Crown. Thus delay might entail very serious pain and loss on Her Majesty's subjects in South Africa, where interests might have grown up under a belief in the efficacy of the local Act. MR. J. LOWTHER opposed the Motion on the ground that the clause was in the usual form, and that the words used were formal words. Question, "That Clause 26 stand part of the Bill," put, and agreed to. Clause 32 (Council for each province). MR. PARNELL moved an Amendment, providing that the Members of the Assembly be elected by the British male Provincial Legislatures and the House of subjects of the age of 21 and upwards, and that due representation of the Natives be also provided for by leave of Her Majesty, and without endangering the Government. His object was to determine how the Provincial Legislatures were to be elected, which was in no way determined by the Bill. Amendment proposed, In page 7, line 10, after the word "such," to insert the words "councillors or councillors and cial Council concerned otherwise directs, by the members of assembly elected, until the Provinvote of every male British subject aged twentyone years or upwards being a householder in such province, and of such number, and elected for such term, as the Queen may direct: Provided always, That provision shall be made for the due representation of the natives in the Provincial Councils, in such manner as shall be deemed by Her Majesty without danger to the stability of the government."—(Mr. Parnell.) MR. J. LOWTHER opposed the Amendment. Question put, "That those words be there inserted." The House divided:-Ayes 5; Noes 188: Majority 183.-(Div. List, No. 298.) AYES Biggar, J. G. Cameron, C. Nolan, Capt. Power, J. O'C. Trevelyan, G.O. TELLERS-Mr. Parnell and Mr. O'Donnell. Clause 37 (Distribution of powers may be varied). of the clause. It was impossible to permit the Home Government to abrogate the action of the Legislature of the Union they were now creating. MR. O'DONNELL moved the omission Amendment proposed, to leave out Clause 37, as amended.-(Mr. O'Donnell.) MR. CHILDERS said, the clause did no more than embody the principles of an Act which had been in operation for Amendment proposed, to leave out the past century, and which it was absoClause 26.-(Mr. O'Donnell.) lutely necessary to maintain. MR. J. LOWTHER, on the part of the Government, accepted the Amendment. Amendment agreed to; words struck out accordingly. Clause, as amended, agreed to, and ordered to stand part of the Bill. MR. PARNELL said, he must differ | the Governor of Natal power to annex from the right hon. Gentleman. If the anything. The Colony had practically Act was to be varied by Order in Council no constitution, and consisted of 20,000 he failed to see what use the Act would nondescript Whites and one of the be. It only showed that the Bill was a worst Native populations in the whole mere sham from beginning to end, that of Africa. it did not respect the rights of the Colonies and States concerned, and that no real scheme of Confederation could possibly be carried out by the Imperial Government. It was a pity that time had been wasted over this Bill. The Government might have been satisfied with passing the first three clauses; those which followed would only plunge the Government into difficulties. But it was futile for him to urge anything. The result of the last division was sufficient to show that it was perfectly absurd— useless for a few Members to contend against the drift of opinion which prevailed in the House upon this question. It would, however, be regretted that the Bill had been hurried through the House in the way it had been. He supported his hon. Friend's proposal to omit the clause. Amendment negatived. as Question, "That Clause 37, amended, stand part of the Bill," put, and agreed to. Clause 47 (Articles duty free within Union). Amendment proposed, In page 11, line 33, after the word "provinces," to insert the words "unless otherwise provided in the articles of Union of any province or Confederated State."-(Mr. O'Donnell.) Question, "That those words be there inserted," put, and negatived. Clause 55 (Laws respecting natives to be reserved). Amendment proposed, in page 13, to leave out from the word "thereon," in line 13, to the word "opportunity," in line 16, inclusive.-(Mr. O'Donnell.) Question, “That the words proposed to be left out stand part of the Bill,” put, and agreed to. Bill to be read the third time Tomorrow. COLONIAL STOCK BILL.-[BILL 228.] (Mr. William Henry Smith, Mr. James Lowther.) SECOND READING. Order for Second Reading read. MR. W. H. SMITH, in moving that the Bill be now read a second time, said, that its clauses had been most carefully considered, and that it would render great benefit to the Colonies. It proposed to authorize the Colonies to issue stock in this country under very carefully-considered regulations, and to enin London. It was a measure which able a register of these stocks to be kept was very earnestly desired by the Colonists. In reply to Questions from Mr. MONK, Sir ANDREW LUSK, and Mr. PARNELL, MR. W. H. SMITH said, the Bill would involve no charge on the Imperial revenue. Provision was made that the holders of the stock should have the most complete notice that it was to be issued on the security of the Colonies only, and that the Imperial Government would be in no way responsible for it. The provisions of the Bill were limited solely to stock issued on the responsibility of the Colonial Government. Motion made, and Question proposed, "That the Bill be now read a second time."—(Mr. W. H. Smith.) Bill read a second time Clause 58 (Power to Her Majesty to for To-morros authorize annexation to Cape or Natal of certain territories.) MR. O'DONNELL moved, in page 13, line 38, the omission of the word "or of Natal." He objected to gi SUPPLY. Order for Committee read. Motion made, and Question proposed, "That Mr. Speaker do now leave the Chair.' tion raised now was whether these gentlemen had acted wrongly in not sending certain persons to be tried for perjury out for doing that. before a jury; but no case was made Mr. Lavery was rightly acquitted; but the learned Judge who tried the case did not recommend that the witnesses should be indicted for LAW AND JUSTICE (IRELAND)-CASE perjury. Naturally feeling aggrieved he OF MR. P. LAVERY. MOTION FOR A SELECT COMMITTEE. MR. BIGGAR rose to call attention to the case of Mr. P. Lavery, who, at the Crumlin Petty Sessions, charged certain persons with wilful and corrupt perjury, said to have been committed with reference to a charge of assault which had been brought against him in the same Court, and which had been sent for trial to the Antrim Quarter Sessions, where, however, it was not allowed to go to the jury. Owing to repeated adjournments the hearing of the charge of perjury extended over 14 months and involved Lavery in expenses to the amount of £120. Ultimately the case was dismissed, although, in his opinion, it was clearly proved that the witnesses who had appeared against Lavery were guilty of perjury. The hon. Member The hon. Member contended that in these circumstances the magistrates-Messrs. Lyons, Douglas, and M'Clintock-had failed to do their duty. He therefore moved for a Select Committee to inquire into their conduct. MR. O'CONNOR POWER seconded the Motion. Amendment proposed, To leave out from the word "That" to the end of the Question, in order to add the words "a Select Committee be appointed to inquire into the conduct of Messrs. Lyons, Douglas, and M'Clintock, at Crumlin petty sessions, regarding Mr. P. Lavery,"-(Mr. Biggar,) -instead thereof. Question proposed, "That the words proposed to be left out stand part of the Question." THE ATTORNEY GENERAL FOR IRELAND (Mr. GIBSON) said, a few words would satisfy the House that there was no necessity of appointing a Select Committee to consider this case. He did not know these three magistrates, and the proper course would be to bring their conduct, if it had been improper, before the Lord Chancellor of Ireland. The ques took steps to prosecute the witnesses; but the magistrates, after careful consideration, came to the conclusion that they would not be justified in committing the parties for trial. He thought it would be a grave injustice to say that the House should, upon the statement of the hon. Member for Cavan, agree to the high prerogative process against these magistrates which was now proposed. He had himself to consider many cases of persons who, having been acthe witnesses who had given evidence quitted of crimes, wished to prosecute against them; but in most cases he assumed that those witnesses were simply mistaken, and always thought that it required grave consideration before directing a criminal prosecution against parties who might have acted bona fide, though erroneously. Question put, and agreed to. Main Question proposed, "That Mr. Speaker do now leave the Chair." Original Motion, by leave, withdrawn. Committee deferred till Monday next. COUNTY OFFICERS AND COURTS (IRE- COMMITTEE. [Progress 24th July.] (In the Committee.) Clauses 68 to 82, inclusive, agreed to. Clause 83 (Fixing and collection of fees and stamp duties). MR. O'CONNOR POWER (for the O'CONOR DON) moved in page 34, line 36, at end, to add— "Provided always, That all Stamp Duties levied under the authority of this, or any of the other aforesaid Acts, shall be regulated on the value of the property sought to be recovered, or ad valorem principle and in proportion to the for which a civil bill decree is granted." |