*SIR J. GORST: I am advised by the trustees of the British Museum that the desired extension of hours could not be carried out without increase of expense; and in view of the great cost of the evening opening, which, to judge by the attendance, does not seem to be as fully appreciated by the public as might have been hoped, they are not disposed to recommend further outlay. the Treasury sanctioned the proposed | Museum at South Kensington is kept terms provided that repayment were open? made upon the instalment system in place of the annuity system. This course was taken in accordance with the principles laid down in the Treasury letter of 24th February to the London County Council as those which should be adopted pending a settlement of the general question. One of the considerations which the Treasury took into account was the opinion of those members of the London County Council who, I think the House will agree, may rightly be regarded as the highest financial authorities among its members. I understand that the sanction of the Local Government Board was given merely to the raising of the money and not to the particular method of repayment. THE CARRIAGE OF IRISH MAILS. MR. KNOX (Cavan, W.): I beg to ask the Postmaster General whether he will consider the advisability of using the Cavan, Leitrim, and Roscommon Light Railway for the carriage of mails, which are now delayed for nearly a day at each end of the line and then conveyed by car; what was the sum demanded by the Railway Company and what was the sum offered by the Post Office for the conveyance of mails over the 50 miles of the company's line when the question was previously considered; and what is the present cost of the conveyance of mails from Belturbet and Dromod respectively to the various stations on the company's line? SIR J. FERGUSSON: The Post Office desired to employ the railway in question for certain day mails, but failed to come to terms. The Post Office offered full parcel rates to the company, which would amount to about £21 a year. The company asked £90. The company could only relieve the present service to a limited extent. The present cost of conveying the mails to the district is £309 a year. THE BRITISH MUSEUM. COLONEL BRIDGEMAN (Bolton): I beg to ask the Secretary to the Treasury whether there is any objection to keeping the British Museum open to the public in the afternoon till the same hour as the Branch MARINE BOILERS. MR. MATHER (Lancashire, S.E., Gorton): I beg to ask the First Lord of the Admiralty whether he will enlarge the scope of the instructions to the Committee of eminent engineers which he has appointed to examine and report on the construction of boilers for the Navy, in the following directions, namely, to conduct on land a series of trials with a boiler worked with forced draught, and constructed so as to be similar and equal as to design, materials, and workmanship to the best boilers now used in the Navy, with the view of ascertaining the efficiency and maximum power of endurance of the same; to conduct on land a similar series of trials with a boiler or boilers embodying all the improvements that may be recommended by the Special Committee, in order that these may be tested under the greatest possible stress to which a boiler can be subjected at full racing speed; and to exhaust, by practical tests on land, all other questions that have arisen out of the shortcomings of the present boilers when worked with forced draught; and whether he is aware that similar exhaustive trials to those here suggested were made to establish the best design and construction of the so-called Lancashire" boilers, before their present high efficiency and durability were obtained? 66 LORD G. HAMILTON: I am obliged to the hon. Member for his suggestion to put marine boilers to the same practical test which, in his own experience, he found to be of value in testing the Lancashire boilers. The proposals in question, with others, will be referred to the Committee for con THE CASE OF MICHAEL CRONIN. MR. FLYNN (Cork, N.): I beg to ask the Attorney General for Ireland whether his attention has been called to the case against Michael Cronin, indicted at the Cork Assizes on the 21st instant on the charge of having stolen four head of cattle, the property of the Earl of Kenmare, in which the accused defended himself on the ground that it was an act of reprisal on the Earl of Kenmare for having made three distraints of his father's cattle; and was the case tried under the Criminal Law and Procedure Act, and what was the result of the trial; and, if so, why was it not tried under the ordinary law? *THE ATTORNEY GENERAL FOR IRELAND (Mr. MADDEN, Dublin University) I am informed that the suggestion contained in the first paragraph of the question was put forward on behalf of Cronin. The accused, however, pleaded guilty to the charge of larceny, and was sentenced to three months' imprisonment, and was bound over to be of good behaviour for three years. Two seizures were made in respect of four years' arrears of rent. The venue was changed to the City of Cork, but the case was investigated by the Magistrates, and subsequently dealt with at the Assizes under the ordinary law. KINSALE PIER LOAN. MR. FLYNN: I beg to ask the Secretary to the Treasury, in connection with the construction of Kinsale Pier, what was the amount of the original sum advanced by the Board of Works; if he can state at what rate was the amount to be repaid, naming principal and interest; what rate of interest was charged on the loan; and how much has been paid by the Kinsale Town and Harbour Commissioners? *SIR J. GORST: The sum advanced was £11,352 15s. 1d.; £630 of this principal sum was repaid, leaving a balance of £10,722 15s. 1d. This sum, with £337, arrears of interest at five per cent., constitutes the total of £11,059 15s. 1d. to be repaid under the Lord G. Hamilton award. There has been no repayment of principal made under the award; but £700 has been paid in respect of arrears of interest. MR. FLYNN: Will the right hon. Gentleman give me a a copy of his answer, as I was not able to take down the figures? LOCAL GOVERNMENT BOARD MEDICAL INSPECTORS. MR. S. T. EVANS (Glamorgan, Mid.): I beg to ask the President of the Local Government Board whether he is aware that the Medical Inspectors of the Board in Wales are unable to speak the Welsh language; and whether, in future appointments of such Inspectors, he will select persons, otherwise well qualified, who will be conversant with the language? As MR. RITCHIE: It is only for the purpose of vaccination inspections that districts are assigned to the Medical Inspectors of the Local Government Board, and officers who act in Wales take English counties as well. regards the general duties of the Inspectors, it is the practice to select for each inquiry the Inspector who appears to be best fitted for the duty, having regard to the engagements of the other members of the staff. At the same time I may say that in the event of my having to fill up an office where the duties of the officer would chiefly be in Wales, and I had before me two candidates who, apart from the question of the Welsh language, were in all other respects equally well qualified for the position, I should be willing to give the preference to the candidate with a knowledge of the Welsh language. CONVICTIONS OF CLERGYMEN. MR. S. T. EVANS: I beg to ask the Secretary of State for the Home Department how many clergymen of the Church of England have been convicted of treason or felony, or convicted on indictment of a misdemeanour, and sentenced to death or penal servitude or to imprisonment with hard labour during the last seven years; and whether, before the Second Reading of the Clergy Discipline (Iminorality) Bill is moved, he will lay upon the Table of the House a Return for such period of seven years showing all such. 49 Royalties on (28 MARCH, 1892) Gold Mines. 50 convictions, with particulars of the one-thirtieth to one-hundreth; that the offences and sentences? Government have withdrawn the Sheriff's officers from Mr. Pritchard Morgan's property, and have consented to allow the question of payment of costs to remain in abeyance pending the issue of the Report of the Royal Commission, and whether he has any information as to the alleged dismissal of men from Welsh gold mines? MR. MATTHEWS: I am unable to answer the first paragraph. The Return asked for would involve a lengthy and expensive investigation, and the information is not necessary for the consideration of the Bill. BUSINESS OF THE HOUSE. THE FIRST LORD OF THE TREA SURY (Mr. A. J. BALFOUR, Manchester, E.) It would be convenient for Treasury reasons that the Royal Assent should be given to the Consolidated Fund Bill to-morrow. I therefore move, "That this House do meet Tomorrow, at a quarter after Ten of the clock," it being, of course, understood that it will be for the purpose of receiving the Royal Assent, and that no other business will be transacted. Motion agreed to. Resolved, That this House do meet To-morrow at a quarter after Ten of the clock a.m.- (Mr. A. J. Balfour.) MR. J. MORLEY (Newcastle-uponTyne): May I ask the right hon. Gentleman what Supply is intended to be taken to-morrow, and what are the arrangements for taking the Scotch Equivalent Grant Bill? MR. A. J. BALFOUR: If we are fortunate enough to get the Speaker out of the Chair to-morrow afternoon, we should proceed with the Civil Service Estimates in Committee. The arrangement with regard to Thursday, which I sketched to the House last week, still holds good, and will be for the general convenience of Scotch Members. Later, the right hon. Gentleman said: I ought, perhaps, to state that I answered the question of the right hon. Gentleman the Member for Newcastle on the assumption that we finish the Second Reading of the Indian Councils Bill tonight, of which I have no doubt. ROYALTIES ON GOLD MINES. MR. LLEWELLYN (Somerset, N.): I beg to ask the Chancellor of the Exchequer a question, of which I have given him private notice-namely, whether is a fact that the royalty on the Morgan Mine has been reduced from MR. GOSCHEN: I have, as the result of communications which have passed between myself and the directors of the Morgan Mine, agreed that the royalty charged upon the product of the mine shall be at the rate of 100th until the Commission on Mining Royalties has reported. The ore which has recently been won at the Morgan Mine is of a low grade, and under the sliding scale which has been offered to the directors of the mine, but not accepted by them, would have been charged with royalty at the rate of 100th. I have made this concession, not because the sliding scale which was offered is inequitable, but to secure a modus vivendi until the whole question can be considered in the light of the Report of the Royal Commission. I have, at the request of several Members of the House, consented to postpone the execution upon Mr. Pritchard Morgan's goods; and, in order that this postponement might take place, he has signed a binding agreement undertaking to allow the Sheriff to re-enter under the same writs. I have agreed that this postponement shall be made, not until the Report of the Mining Royalties Commission is received, but to allow time in which the hon. Member may be persuaded to allow better counsels to prevail with him with reference to such payment. I understand that the workmen who have recently been dismissed from the Morgan Mine were not in Mr. Pritchard Morgan's employment, and their dismissal had, as I have been assured by a director, no connection with the steps taken by the Government to recover costs from Mr. Pritchard Morgan. MR. A. O'CONNOR: May I ask the Chancellor of the Exchequer whether the Treasury will be willing to extend to the gold mining industry in Ireland the same terms as those which have been granted to Wales? 51 Indian Councils Act (COMMONS} (1861) Amendment Bill. 52 MR. GOSCHEN: Under the sliding scale, if there is any mine in Ireland where the hundredth part will secure the working of the mine, I shall be glad to grant the same terms. SMALL HOLDINGS BILL. MR. WINTERBOTHAM (Gloucester, Cirencester): May I ask the right hon. Gentleman if he will state that it is not intended to take the Small Holdings Bill to-night? MR. A. J. BALFOUR: I think I can say that we do not propose to take it before next Monday, and to take it from next Monday as continuously as the business will allow. It is convenient to hon. Members that they should have a little time to put down Amendments. IRISH LOCAL GOVERNMENT BILL. MR. SEXTON: Does the right hon. Gentleman intend to move the Second Reading of the Irish Local Government Bill before Easter? MR. A. J. BALFOUR: That must depend on the progress of the Committee on the Small Holdings Bill; if we make as much progress as I hope for, we shall take it before Easter. CLERGY DISCIPLINE BILL. MR. F. S. POWELL (Wigan): May I ask the right hon. Gentleman whether he intends to proceed with the Clergy Discipline Bill this evening? MR. A. J. BALFOUR: I hope so, if we should finish the Indian Councils Bill in sufficient time to make it worth while to bring it on. ORDNANCE FACTORIES BILL. MR. J. MORLEY: When will the right hon. Gentleman go on with the Ordnance Factories Bill? MR. A. J. BALFOUR: I may put it down for to-morrow, as the Debate is nearly exhausted. EVICTIONS AT GWEEDORE. MR. MAC NEILL: May I inform the Chief Secretary for Ireland that I have to-day received a telegram from one of the parish priests at Gweedore, and ask him whether it is true that a relieving officer has received notice of the imminent eviction of sixteen families on the estate of Mrs. Orr; and whether, having regard to the fact which I have brought to the notice of the House that the cause of the eviction is merely the question of costs between landlord and tenant, he will not allow the Forces of the Crown to be employed? *MR. JACKSON: I have no information with reference to this case except that which the hon. Gentleman has just given to me. Of course, I can make no promise as to what protection will be afforded if it be applied for. MR. MAC NEILL: Will the right hon. Gentleman allow me to put documents before him which will show the terrible harshness in the case? MR. JACKSON: If the hon. Gentleman desires to put any information before me, of course I will examine it. ORDER OF THE DAY. INDIAN COUNCILS ACT (1861) AMENDMENT BILL-[Lords]-(No. 182.) SECOND READING. OF Order for Second Reading read. *THE UNDER SECRETARY STATE FOR INDIA (Mr. CURZON, Lancashire, Southport): I am glad, Sir, at this early period of the Session, to be able to introduce to the notice of the House a Bill which, if carried into law, will, I believe, be fraught with advantage to the interests of our fellowsubjects in India. It is sometimes said, Sir, that this House bestows but a scant and reluctant concern upon the interests of the millions of India. And yet I am not sure that this alleged indifference of the many, if it be true, which I do not altogether accept, is not more than compensated for by the vigilant and uncompromising attention of the few, whilst I have heard it stated on high authority that the greater interference of this House in the government of India might not be a source of unmixed benefit to that country. ever that may be, Sir, I hope that this Bill will be one that may approve itself to both sections of opinion in this House-both to those hon. Members who may not have direct and personal experience of India, and to that smaller section who, either from long residence there or from official experience, are emphatically entitled to How speak on Indian questions, and whose | twelve additional Members who are interference in our debates is always nominated by the Governor General, and welcome. And perhaps I may be of whom at least one-half must be nonpermitted to take this opportunity of official, whether drawn from the expressing the regret which I am European or the native element. The sure has been felt on both sides of the Legislative Councils of Madras and House at the disappearance from Bombay are also recruited by a miniamong their number of the omnivorous mum of four and a maximum of eight intellect of the late hon. Gentleman the additional Members who are nominated Member for Kirkcaldy (Sir George by the Provincial Governor, and of Campbell). The object of this Bill whom at least one-half must be nonwhich it is my duty to explain to the official. Since the passing of that Act, House is to widen the basis and to Sir, Legislative Councils have been expand the functions of government in called into existence for Bengal and India; to give further opportunities than the North-West Provinces. In Bengal at present exist to the non-official and the Council consists of the Lieutenant native elements in Indian society Governor and twelve nominated Memto take part in the work of govern- bers, and the Council of the North-West ment, and in this way to lend official Provinces consists of the Lieutenant recognition to that remarkable develop- Governor and nine Councillors, of whom, ment both of political interest and in each case, one-third must be nonpolitical capacity which has been official. Such is the constitution of the visible among the higher classes of legislative machinery which has existed Indian society since the Government during the past 30 years. This system of India was taken over by the Crown has undoubtedly worked well. It has in 1858. In form this Bill is one to justified itself and the anticipations of amend the India Councils Act of 1861. its promoters. Operating to a very large Legislative powers of some sort or extent through the agency of special other, but powers of somewhat con- committees composed of experienced fused character and conflicting validity, persons, it has proved to be an efficient have existed in India for a very long instrument for the evolution of laws. time. The publicity which has attended every stage of its proceedings has had a good effect. A number of native gentlemen of intelligence, capacity, and public spirit have been persuaded to come forward and lend their services to the functions of Government, and undoubtedly the standard of merit in these Legislative Councils has stood high. Indeed, I would venture to say that few better legislative machines, with regard to their efficacy for the particular object for which they were constructed, are anywhere in existence, nor can better legislation produced by such bodies be found in any other country. At the same time, these Councils have been subject to restrictions and limitations which were intentionally, and I think wisely, imposed upon them in the first place. The House must recognise that they are in no sense of the term Parliamentary bodies. They are deliberative bodies with a comparatively narrow scope, inasmuch as they only assemble for the discussion of the immediate legislation which lies before them, and are not per They existed under the rule of the old East India Company, dating from the times of the Tudor and Stuart sovereigns; but the modern legislative system, under which the Government | of India exists, owes its origin to the Viceroyalty of Lord Canning, and the Secretaryship of State of Sir Charles Wood, afterwards Lord Halifax, who in 1861, carried through the House the India Councils Act of that year. I may, perhaps, in starting, be permitted to remind the House briefly of the provisions of that Act, as they are the basis on which we are now attempting to proceed. The Act of 1861 constituted three Legislative Councils in India-the Supreme Legislative Council of the Viceroy and the Provincial Legislative Councils of Madras and Bombay. The Supreme Legislative Council of the Viceroy, or, as it is called in the terms of the Act, the Council "for the purpose of making laws and regulations only," consists of the Governor General and his Executive Council, with a minimum of six and a maximum of |