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Mr. ANTHONY. All the statistics which you gather have to conform with the law ?
Mr. Fitts. I imagine there will be very many statistics collected which it will be necessary to get together and consider.
Mr. ANTHONY. You are concerned in the administration of the law, the violations of the law. Why do you have to compile statistics!
Mr. Firts. In the reports which are issued by the exchanges or the members there probably will be a great deal of information which will have to be considered to see whether there is anything which is in violation of the law.
The CHAIRMAN. These men will have to analyze them?
Mr. Fitts. They will have to analyze the material which will be collected.
The CHAIRMAN. And then formulate it? Mr. Fitts. Formulate it into some comprehensive form. Mr. Wood. Why is it necessary with this new office to have an administrator in charge and an assistant in charge here in Washington
Mr. Firts. This is purely tentative. What the future requirements will be I can not, of course, say at this time.
Mr. Wood. I suppose it has grown out of the practice that every chief has to have an assistant. Is not that about it?
Mr. Firts. I can say that I understand the Secretary's attitude, and it would be his idea not to carry any more employees than necessary.
Mr. Wood. But you do not know whether or not it will be necessary?
Mr. Fitts. This is entirely new; it is merely the groundwork.
The CHAIRMAN. You are simply making a tentative statement of how you arrived at the $50,000 ?
Mr. Fitrs. Yes, sir.
The CHAIRMAN. You do not know whether this will be the organization or not?
Mr. Fitts. Yes; this will be the organization at the start. It may be the permanent organization and it may not be necessary to have anybody else. On the other hand, it may be necessary, as we become familiar with the transactions on the market and see what develops and transpires, to increase the force.
The CHAIRMAN. How do the salaries carried here compare with the salaries for similar services elsewhere?
Mr. Fitts. These salaries are comparable, I think, to other employees in the department. There is always difficulty, of course, in getting men who are familiar with particular trade practices at salaries usually paid by the Government.
Mr. Wood. The amount you are paying the assistant in charge is just the amount paid the Assistant Secretary of Agriculture?
Mr. Fitrs. Yes, sir.
The CHAIRMAN. Do you anticipate that this organization will be materially enlarged after you get into the work or do you expect to be able to continue the enforcement of the act with the number of employees enumerated ?
Mr. Fitrs. I should imagine-
The CHAIRMAN (interposing). Section 9 is not incorporated in this activity?
Mr. FITTS. No, sir. These people will handle the regulatory end of it-will cover that generally. As to how that will develop, I do not know. It will depend upon what information is procured, the suggestions we receive on it, or the importance of the further development of this phase of the situation. Mr. Wood. How many market superivsors are to be located here?
Mr. Fitrs. There will be none here. These are really grain exchange supervisors. They call them market supervisors. There will be one at Chicago and one at Minneapolis. They will each have an assistant, with a statistician. At Kansas City there will be simply the market supervisor, it being a smaller market.
The CHAIRMAN. Do you need these economists, or have you not a lot of economists in the department who could work out the problems?
Mr. Firts. As I have said, they have not gone into that yet. That was the organization which they thought would be necessary to start with. As they get into the work
The CHAIRMAN (interposing). What would be the economist's duties?
Mr. FITTS. I believe he would consider all of the information which was secured and would go into the broader phase of the future exchanges and problems incident thereto.
The CHAIRMAN. Of course, we realize that this is a new activity, and we are looking for information and we want you to give us what information you can.
Mr. Fitrs. All I can say is that generally they believe a man like that will be needed to consider the question in its broader aspects.
The CHAIRMAN. Do you think that you ought to have a specialist on this particular work; that it is of sufficient importance to justify a man devoting all his time to it?
Mr. Firts. I should say so; yes, sir.
Mr. ANDERSON. Will this activity come under the director of the regulatory work or merely under the Secretary?
Mr. Firms. As it is now, Mr. Morrill has been designated in charge. Mr. Morrill is directly under the Secretary, as assistant to the Secretary. He has been placed in charge of this work and also of some other regulatory work.
Mr. ANDERSON. This will not come under the regulatory work in the department?
Mr. FITTs. The director of regulatory work has not yet been appointed, and just what will be done in connection with the position I do not know, because no announcement has been made. Neither do I know what the lineup will be of the various regulatory work in the department. Whether it will all be put under the director of the regulatory work, if appointed, I am not prepared to say. The Secretary has not made any announcement.
Mr. ANDERSON. The Bureau of Markets has been gathering statistical material with reference to prices, rates, and so forth, at these grain markets. Will the work with regard to the statistical material at these markets be transferred to this item or will it be continued as it is now?
Mr. Fitts. It will be continued where it is now, as far as I know.
Mr. TINCHER. Mr. Chairman, I happen to know that the Secretary did not make
estimate for the enforcement of section 9 of this bill, because he did not want to duplicate any work; he tried to avoid any duplication.
Mr. ANDERSON. What I had in mind was that there does not seem to be any reason for gathering prices, statistics, and rates, material of that kind, in one place, and then gathering the same material at some other place?
Mr. Fitts. I am sure the Secretary would not approve of it if he found there was any duplication.
Mr. ANDERSON. The Secretary does not know everything that is going on all the time.
The CHAIRMAN. This does not contemplate any duplication ?
The CHAIRMAN. If you happen to transfer this particular work to the director, of course, it would result in duplication ?
Mr. Firts. If there is any duplication it will be corrected.
Mr. Wood. How do you arrive at the conclusion that you need two market assistants at two places and at the other will not need any assistant market inspector?
Mr. Fitts. I may say that that depends upon the size of the market. At Chicago and Minneapolis we provide for a supervisor and assistant, but at Kansas City just the supervisor, with no assistant.
Mr. Wood. You do not know, it may be that the market supervisor may be able to do the work in all of those places? Nr. Fitts. If so, the assistants will be eliminated.
Mr. Woods. You know that they never eliminate any office when once established. Why should we not commence with the chief, and if they need an assistant provide for that afterwards? You never heard of an office in this Government being abolished.
Mr. Fitts. They were considered necessary; that is all I can say.
Mr. ANDERSON. What will be the duties of the examiners specified hore !
Mr. Firts. They will examine the records and information submitted, and such related matter as may be pertinent.
Mr. ANDERSON. Will they be Washington employees? Mr. Fitrs. Yes, sir. Mr. ANDERSON. And the chief clerk will also be in Washington? Mr. FITTS. Yes, sir. Mr. ANDERSON. And he will have five other clerks? Mr. FITTS. Yes, sir. Mr. ANDERSON. 'Is it necessary to have a chief clerk and five clerks? Mr. Fitts. The chief clerk is the principal clerk in the whole division. He will be in charge of the clerical work and take care of the other offices, their clerical and property needs, etc., and have general supervision.
EMPLOYEES IN WASHINGTON.
Mr. KELLEY. As to these 27 people, please tell us which ones are to be in Washington?
Mr. Fitts. The administrator, the assistant, the economist, the examiner, chief clerk, five clerks, and a messenger.
The CHAIRMAN. They will be in Washington?
The CHAIRMAN. You will only have a market supervisor and an assistant supervisor at Chicago and at Minneapolis ?
Mr. FITTS. Yes, sir; including a clerk and messenger.
The CHAIRMAN. Let me ask you, if I may, this question: These men in Washington will get the information upon which they base their activities from the men in the field?
Mr. Fitts. Yes, sir; I suppose in part.
The CHAIRMAN. Would they not have to get it all, and does it not look rather topheavy to have 11 in Washington and only 5 in the field?
Mr. Fitts. The headquarters is the place where the information from all the markets is submitted; and it will require, as I see it, a considerable number of assistants. A great deal of work will be involved where the data is all assembled and finally considered.
The CHAIRMAN. The only question that occurred to me was thisof course, this is a new proposition, but the practical side of it which has occurred to me is that if you have 5 men in the field developing information which has to be submitted to somebody else, would it not rather seem impossible for those 5 men to furnish information sufficient to keep 22 other men busy?
Mr. TINCHER. Pardon me. Permit me to explain that, Mr. Chairman.
The CHAIRMAN. Yes, sir.
Mr. TINCHER. Under this law each member of the Chicago exchange files a copy of all transactions he makes every day with the exchange, and the Chicago office will have access to those transactions. If for any reason the Secretary of Agriculture concluded that the market was being manipulated and cared to go into that, the sending to Washington of two days' transactions on the Chicago exchange would keep the people employed and busy. I know a little about that because of connection with it in the past.
The CHAIRMAN. Of course that answers the question.
Mr. Fitts. The reports in the contract markets would have attention whenever there seemed to be any irregularity.
The CHAIRMAN. I understood you to say when you first took the stand that this information would be on file at the point where the transactions took place and would be available to the Secretary of Agriculture?
Mr. Fitts. Yes, sir. The CHAIRMAN. And I got the impression—I do not know whether you stated it or not—that it would not be sent here, only be accessible ?
Mr. Fitts. It may be sent here. I do not believe that I covered that particular point.
Mr. Byrns. What portion, if any, of this force will be appointed through the civil service?
Mr. Fitts. The force will all be appointed through the civil service.
Mr. Wood. I notice that you have all the clerks listed at $1,800.
The CHAIRMAX. Is there anything further you wish to say about this item?
Mr. Fitts. No, sir; that is all.
Mr. Sisson. I should like to ask one further question. This act does provide for the appointment of certain people ?
Mr. FITTS. Yes, sir.
Mr. Sisson. And provides for the organization which you have outlined here?
Mr. Firts. It does not particularly provide for that organization.
The CHAIRMAN. It authorizes the Secretary of Agriculture to enforce a certain act?
Mr. Sisson. That is what I had in mind. If the act does require that. Why is it that every time we pass a statute of any kind it becomes necessary to organize a particular, separate, and distinct force to enforce it?
Mr. FITTS. Well, the only answer I can make is that the people appointed to do their work in the department are busy on that particular work.
Mr. Wood. They do not have any leisure at all.
The CHAIRMAN. The first thing that we must take into consideration in this problem is that in the law passed by Congress, section 13 provides :
The Secretary of Agriculture may cooperate with any department or agency of the Government, any State, Territory, District, or possession, or department, agency, or political subdivision thereof, or any person; and shall have the power to appoint, remove, and fix the compensation of such officers and employees, not in conflict with existing law, and make such expenditures for rent outside the District of Columbia, printing, telegrams, telephones, law books, books of reference, periodicals, furniture, stationery, office equipment, travel, and other supplies and expenses as shall be necessary to the administration of this act in the District of Columbia and elsewhere, and there is hereby authorized to be appropriated, out of any moneys in the Treasury not otherwise appropriated, such sums as may be necessary for such purposes.
Mr. Wood. And that is the pin hook on which they hang this.
WEDNESDAY, NOVEMBER 9, 1921.
ERADICATION OF TUBERCULOSIS FROM ANIMALS.
STATEMENT OF HON. DANIEL A. REED, MEMBER OF CONGRESS.
The CHAIRMAN. Mr. Reed, you introduced a bill, H. R. 8877, on the 26th of October proposing an appropriation of $600,000 for the payment of indemnities on account of slaughtered tubercularly infected cattle. That bill has been referred to this committee, and provides as follows:
Be it enacted by the Senate and House of Representatives of the United States of America in Congress assembled, That there is hereby appropriated, out of any money in the Treasury not otherwise appropriated, to supply deficiencies in appropriations in the fiscal year ending June 30, 1922, and prior fiscal years, the following sum: