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Mr. ADLERMAN (reading):

of 1536 Anderson Avenue, Fort Lee, N.J., formerly of Union City, N.J., since approximately 1950. He has been on the corporate and later the partnership payroll since about 1952 starting at $100 and his present salary on the partnership payroll as of Wednesday, April 9, 1958, for the week ending April 12, 1958, was $200 per week for services exclusively performed outside the State of Delaware. In 1949 and 1950 our business was local and interstate. Since 1952 our business strictly and exclusively interstate.

Ralph Atlas' services include his finding a phone in a room or house near a track where someone could stay and receive from inside the track who would be a "flash artist" and who could send him the correct numbers of the winners. Ralph Atlas would give the telephone number of the place near the track which we could call for the flash result. At the end of the week I would arrange to pay the men for their services and pay direct for the room. This was our operation in New York at the New York tracks. He has arranged the same setups for us in Maryland, New Jersey, Virginia, Florida, New England and in any part of the United States where it would be to our advantage_excepting Delaware, He has been doing this all the long for us up to now.

When we opened up we had a Continental News printer until they closed up around 1951 after the Kefauver committee hearings. I heard Ralph Atlas was an arranger for getting flash results from the tracks and we hired him to replace our Continental News facilities.

Our business is to get fast flash results to our customers before the radio and newspaper announcements. We have to do this to survive. I have read the above, it is correct.

/s/ JOSEPH TOLLIN, Senior Partner.

/s/ ALBERT J. TOLLIN, Junior Partner. Witness:

/s/ THOMAS LAVENIA.
/s/ WALTER J. WASSMER,

Delaware State Detective. Mr. ADLERMAN. Is that a correct description of your activity and your employment by the Delaware Wire Services?

Mr. ATLAS. I respectfully decline to answer because to do so might incriminate me. Mr. ADLERMAN. Mr. Atlas, how many times have you

been arrested ?

Mr. Atlas. I respectfully decline to answer because to do so might incriminate me.

Mr. ADLERMAN. I believe the record shows, and I have a criminal record here

(At this point Senator Curtis entered the hearing room.)

Mr. ADLERMAN (continuing). That he has been arrested some 10 times.

The CHAIRMAN. Do you have someone to put this in?
Mr. ADLERMAN. Mr. Tierney can put it in.

The CHAIRMAN. I believe the last arrest here shows—according to this document you handed me, it shows 13, I believe. Some are the same. There are 10 in all. I don't know what happened to this last one. Here is one as late as October 1960, bookmaking and possession of bookmaking records. Has that been disposed of!

Mr. ATLAS. I respectfully declined to answer because to do so might incriminate me.

The CHAIRMAN. The last one previous to that was February 1950 on a charge of being a disorderly person. The record shows you were found guilty and fined $100. Is that correct?

Mr. ATLAS. I respectfully decline to answer because to do so might incriminate me.

The CHAIRMAN. You were fined for the same offense apparently back in March of 1952; is that right?

Mr. Atlas. I respectfully decline to answer because to do so might incriminate me.

The CHAIRMAN. You may place this in evidence, counsel, whenever you

have the witness who can identify it. Mr. ADLERMAN. Mr. Tierney. The CHAIRMAN. Mr. Tierney has been previously sworn.

TESTIMONY OF PAUL J. TIERNEY-Resumed

The CHAIRMAN. Mr. Tierney, what have we presented to you here?

Mr. TIERNEY. The official criminal record of the FBI, Mr. Chairman, of Ralph Atlas, No. 2309361. The record in summary shows 10 arrests and 6 convictions.

The CHAIRMAN. Very well. Mr. Atlas, do you want to deny this record, admit it, or make any comment on it at all? It may not be you. If it is not you, just say so.

Mr. Atlas. I respectfully decline to answer because to do so might incriminate me.

The CHAIRMAN. Very well. This may be made exhibit No. 31 for reference.

(The document referred to was marked "Exhibit No. 31" for reference and may be found in the files of the subcommittee.)

The CHAIRMAN. Anything further?
Mr. ADLERMAN. Yes.

Mr. Atlas, do you know Mr. Frank Ferrara of the Sports Day News or Atlantic Carriers in Boston ?

Mr. ATLAS. I respectfully decline to answer because to do so might incriminate me.

Mr. ADLERMAN. In 1955 were you assoicated with Mr. Ferrara in an attempt to set up a Providence race wire service?

Mr. ATLAS. I respectfully decline to answer because to do so might incriminate me.

Mr. ADLERMAN. Do you have any knowledge of a hoodlum group or racketeer group from Chicago, New York, and New Jersey, who were putting up $20,000 to set up a system of racetrack results in the horse track in New England at that time?

Mr. ATLAS. I respectfully decline to answer because to do so might incriminate me.

Mr. ADLERMAN. In the spring of 1958, Mr. Atlas, were you one of the corporate members or one of the officers or stockholders of the Sports News Service, address 3016 Nichols Avenue, Washington, D.C.?

Mr. Atlas. I respectfully decline to answer because to do so might incriminate me.

Mr. ADLERMAN. Did you petition, as one of the officers of the corporation, the Washington, D.C. Public Utilities Commission to force the Chesapeake & Potomac Telephone Co. to provide the service of 45 telephones to be used to convey racing results to a projected sports paper of the Sports News Service?

Mr. Atlas. I respectfully decline to answer because to do so might incriminate me.

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Mr. ADLERMAN. In 1953, did you have a bodyguard named Eddie?

Mr. ATLAS. I respectfully decline to answer because to do so might incriminate me.

Mr. ADLERMAN. Were you handling as high as $20,000 and $40,000 of bets in New York City and accompanied by this Eddie at that time?

Mr. ATLAS. I respectfully decline to answer because to do so might incriminate me.

Mr. ADLERMAN. Who were you handling those bets for?

Mr. ATLAS. I respectfully decline to answer because to do so might incriminate me.

Mr. ADLERMAN. Are you familiar with or do you know Charles “The Blade" Tourine !

Mr. Atlas. I respectfully decline to answer because to do so might incriminate me.

Mr. ADLERMAN. Are you familiar with his record, or do whether he is a racketeer or not?

Mr. Atlas. I respectfully decline to answer because to do so might incriminate me.

Mr. ADLERMAN. Have you been ejected from all of the tracks which are controlled by the Thoroughbred Racing Association? Are you barred from those tracks?

Mr. Atlas. I respectfully decline to answer because to do so might incriminate me.

The CHAIRMAN. Is he on the list of those barred that was submitted ?
Mr. ADLERMAN. Yes, he is.
The CHAIRMAN. What is the name of that organization?
Mr. ADLERMAN. The Thoroughbred Racing Protective Bureau.
The CHAIRMAN. He is barred from the track?
Mr. ADLERMAN. That is right.
The CHAIRMAN. Do you know that or is this news to you?

Mr. Atlas. I respectfully decline to answer because to do so might incriminate me.

Mr. ADLERMAN. Were you named by James F. Kennedy, deputy chief commissioner of the New York City Police Department, as one of the three men arrested on a past post operation involving New Jersey bookmakers?

Mr. ATLAS. I respectfully decline to answer because to do so might incriminate me.

The CHAIRMAN. Is that a pretty lucrative racket of betting on a horse where the race is won and the bookie doesn't know it?

Mr. Atlas. I respectfully decline to answer because to do so might incriminate me.

The CHAIRMAN. You don't have any of that kind of money that you won that way?

Mr. ATLAS. Pardon?

The CHAIRMAN. You don't have any of that kind of money now, do you, that you won that way?

Mr. Atlas. I respectfully decline to answer because to do so might incriminate me.

Mr. ADLERMAN. Mr. Atlas, have you ever delayed giving out a flash result so that you could get in a bet yourself before you gave out the results?

Mr. Atlas. I respectfully decline to answer because to do so might incriminate me.

The CHAIRMAN. A fellow that would do that would be about on the same level as a thief, wouldn't he? Wouldn't you think so?

Mr. Atlas. I respectfully decline to answer because to do so might incriminate me.

Senator ERVIN. That is one thing certain; that is not gambling, because gambling is a game of chance, and if a race is over and he gets a gullible person to bet with him on a race that has already been won, there is no chance of a man's winning there.

Mr. Atlas. I respectfully decline to answer because to do so might incriminate me.

Mr. ADLERMAN. Were you yourself taken for $40,000 on Wall Street on some phony oil leases? Do you want to tell us about that?

Mr. ATLAS. I respectfully decline to answer because to do so might incriminate me.

Mr. ADLERMAN. That cannot possibly incriminate you.
Mr. ATLAS. It might.

Mr. ADLERMAN. Did you hire Herman “Tiny" Schulberg to collect this money from the Wall Street sharpies!

Mr. ATLAS. I respectfully decline to answer because to do so might incriminate me.

The CHAIRMAN. You have both taken and been took.

Mr. ADLERMAN. Last year about April 22, 1960, were you questioned by the stewards of the Aqueduct Race Track concerning the fact that a known bookmaker in Florida named Al Mones had arranged to fix a horse to win the first race on April 21, 1960 ?

Mr. Atlas. I respectfully decline to answer because to do so might incriminate me.

Mr. ADLERMAN. You were not indicted. You were not arrested or anything of that sort in that case. How could it incriminate you?

Mr. ATLAS. It might. Mr. ADLERMAN. Did you bet yourself or put a bet on that horse of $3,300 ?

Mr. ATLAS. I respectfully decline to answer because to do so might incriminate me.

Mr. ADLERMAN. No further questions.
The CHAIRMAN. Anything else?

All right, Mr. “Flash Gordon," you may stand aside, and thank you very much.

Call the next witness. Mr. ADLERMAN. I would like to call these two witnesses together, perhaps we might be able to go a little faster.

The CHAIRMAN. It is going to be brief.
Mr. ADLERMAN. I would say 15 or 20 minutes.
The CHAIRMAN. Very well.
Mr. ADLERMAN. Mr. Alex Estrin and Miss Lucille Lorraine Rice.
The CHAIRMAN. Will you two witnesses be sworn?

You and each of you do solemnly swear the evidence you shall give before this Senate subcommittee shall be the truth, the whole truth, and nothing but the truth, so help you God?

Miss RICE. I do.
Mr. ESTRIN. I do.

TESTIMONY OF ALEXANDER ESTRIN AND LUCILLE LORRAINE

RICE, ACCOMPANIED BY COUNSEL, HENRY A. WISE, JR. The CHAIRMAN. Will the lady witness state her name, her place of residence, and business or occupation ?

Miss Rice. Lucille L. Rice, Laurel, Md., reporter.
The CHAIRMAN. A reporter?
Miss RICE. Yes.
The CHAIRMAN. Thank you.
And your name?
Mr. ĚSTRIN. Alexander Estrin, Laurel, Md., sports reporter.
The CHAIRMAN. Do you have counsel ?

Mr. WISE. Your Honor, Henry A. Wise, Jr., member of the Delaware and New York bar.

The CHAIRMAN. Let the record show the same counsel as appeared for Mr. Tollin.

All right, Mr. Counsel, you may proceed.
Mr. ADLERMAN. Mr. Estrin, where were you born?
Mr. ESTRIN. Wales, England.
Mr. ADLERMAN. And when did you come to the United States ?
Mr. ESTRIN. When I was about 6 or 7 years old.
Mr. ADLERMAN. In about 1921 or so?
Mr. ESTRIN. Yes.
Mr. ADLERMAN. Are you a citizen?
Mr. ESTRIN. Yes, sir.
Mr. ADLERMAN. Through your father's citizenship?
Mr. ESTRIN. An act of Congress.

Mr. ADLERMAN. Was your father connected with the raising of horses and ownership of horses?

Mr. ESTRIN. He was.

Mr. ADLERMAN. And are you employed by the Delaware Sports Service at the present time?

Mr. ESTRIN. Yes, sir.
Mr. ADLERMAN. What did you say your occupation was?
Mr. ESTRIN. Reporter.
Mr. ADLERMAN. You mean a track reporter?
Mr. ESTRIN. Sports reporter.

Mr. ADLERMAN. Would I be wrong in saying that you would be a flasher of race results ?

Mr. ESTRIN. No; I don't think so.
Mr. ADLERMAN. What was that?
Mr. ESTRIN. No, sir.

Mr. ADLERMAN. Would that be the proper term to be applied to the work that you do?

Mr. ESTRIN. Yes, sir.
Mr. ADLERMAN. Do you sometimes act as a catcher, also ?
Mr. ESTRIN. Yes, sir.
Mr. ADLERMAN. And what is-

The CHAIRMAN. As I understand, the pitcher is the one at the track that gets it and throws the information out, and somebody catches it, figuratively speaking? Mr. ESTRIN. Yes, sir; and right now I am benched.

The CHAIRMAN. That wasn't because you made errors, but just because of the sudden change in the weather?

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