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Ministers of the Crown in Canada and of leading politicians of the Conservative Party in Canada with reference to preferential trade and reduced taxation on British goods. He was very glad to observe that the hon. Gentleman applied to tariffs on goods a different interpretation to that usually held by those who opposed the views of hon. Members on that side of the House. He said that Lancashire people had to pay taxation amounting to £200,000 in order to get their goods into Canada. If that was the case it was not the consumer but the Lancashire manufacturer who paid the

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Commons no less distinguished a Gentleman than the right hon. Gentleman the Member for West Bristol said—

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I confess that, speaking for myself, I would go a long way if I could secure a Zollverein between the Colonies and the United Kingdom and some common tariff applicable to them all."

Again and again on public platforms in Canada the leaders of what was called the Conservative Party in that country had supported the proposals of the right hon. Gentleman the Member for West

Birmingham. More than that they had

heard to-night about the conference in Montreal and the resolution which was passed at it. It surprised him that the hon. Gentleman who brought up that matter found occasion to oppose the idea

MR. LLOYD-GEORGE said that that of preference in this House, since he helped

was not what he stated.

SIR GILBERT PARKER said he merely mentioned the point to show the character of the statements which came from those who were preaching the doctrine of absolute free trade which did not exist. With reference to the opinion of leaders of political thought in Canada, he would challenge the hon. Gentleman as to whether for the last twenty years both Parties in Canada had not been in favour of preferential treatment in the British market and had shown their adherence to that principle of preference by offering this country preference in their own markets on manufactured goods. They were told that it did not amount to much, and perhaps 33 per cent. was not a very great deal, but he wished to point out that in 1893 the Canadian House of Commons passed a Resolution in favour of preference with this country, and when that Resolution was referred to the British House of

to draw up the Montreal resolution which approved of the principle of preference He would ask the House if they thoroughly understood the position taken up by the Colonies in this matter. He thought it was not an unreasonable position They offered preference, but was this country to give nothing in return? He believed that there was no Legislature in the Colonies that was not prepared, according to their situation and to the tariffs which they adopted for their own needs, to give consideration to British goods. That consideration would naturally be in proportion to their opportuni ties. It would not be of course, as had been suggested, the taking off of all taxation on British goods. That would be an unreasonable suggestion. What they offered was a fair exchange and a greater reduction on British goods than they gave to any other country.

MR. GUEST (Plymouth) asked if the Colonies had offered a reduction.

matter. Only a few years ago Lord Rosebery, in a speech which was reported in the palladium of the Liberal Party, the Daily News, drew attention to the matter. He devoted a great deal of time to showing that there was a distinct decline in British trade, and the remedy he found was technical education, throwing the blame for the decline of trade on the uneducated British working man and the unenterprising British manufacturer. He did not believe that the public in this country quite believed that all their difficulties arose from a lack of technical skill. Sir William Ramsay at Bradford had something to say on this question. He said that it was not by technical skill alone that Germany was successful, but also because she applied a scientific tariff in order to protect and develop her trade and enable her to invade the British market. Germany admitted British manufactured goods of all kinds, especially partly manufactured goods, and applied to them technical skill, returning them. when completed to the very district where they were partly manufactured. When it was stated that protection only meant high tariffs put on without consideration of any of the circumstances, it showed that the question was not thoroughly understood. Germany applied to her industries the same scientific industry that

SIR GILBERT PARKER said that was being roused in connection with this Canada had offered a reduction of 33 per cent., but they could not expect the Colonies to make a general offer until the principle of preference had been adopted by this country. The Colonies had accepted the principle of preference. Sir Wilfrid Laurier, speaking at the Montreal banquet, said he believed that the principle of preference would be of benefit to Canada, but that they did not wish to press their views on their brethren in Great Britain, and would wait until they had decided what course they would pursue. Surely it was reasonable that Canada, having accepted the principle of preference, should ask this country what course it intended to pursue. He would venture to put this point to the House. This country was taking every year from the United States about 50,000,000 cwts. of corn. The quantity was growing less every year, as the United States was producing less corn in proportion to its population than it produced ten years ago, and it was absolutely certain that, in a few years, this country would have to pay more for its corn whether it liked it or not. It would have to widen the area of supply, and was it not reasonable that it should look to those fields which were within the Empire for securing the corn it required. A 2s. duty on corn would mean that in time of peace and in time of war the food supply of this country was secured.

They had been told by the hon. Gentleman who had just spoken that this question had been sprung on the country in, so to speak, a night. He did not think that was entirely due to the right hon. Gentleman the Member for West Birmingham, because before the right hon. Gentleman spoke there were indications that popular opinion

she applied to her Army, that this country applied to its Navy, and that this country should also apply to its Army. Germany applied that technical skill which this country first taught her, and which came from educated working men. Now, however, it seemed to him that the apprentice was steadily taking possession of his master's business. He did not think it was a matter of congratulation that this

country imported £90,000,000 of manu- countries. They had been challenged on factured goods from foreign countries, at the position they had taken up on the least half of which could be manufactured question of tariff reform. He himself at home. Was it reasonable that all could not pretend to any sort of belief silks should be admitted free into that the principle of retaliation was in this country to the detriment of the itself sufficient, for he did not believe home silk manufacturers. 200,000,000 they could have effective retaliation cwts. of flour was imported every unless it sprung from a system of tariffs. year. Could not that be manufactured in How great the tariffs were to be was, this country? In such circumstances they however, another question. He did not ought to consider whether the decline of believe that the people of this country British trade was not due to something would ever adopt a tariff system like else than the mere competition of other that of the United States. When they countries. He believed the time had were challenged about the success of come for reconsidering the position. protective systems in other countries, he At present this country sold to the Colonies thought they were standing upon safe goods to the value of £109,000,000, and ground. They were challenged about to foreign countries goods to the value wages, but wages in the United States were of £140,000,000. If the Colonies bought double what they were in this country. of this country £1 worth of goods for It seemed to him that he would have the every £1 this country bought of them, support of the Irish Members, because would not that be worth considering? Irish tobacco was now to receive a bounty, The Colonies were young nations, vigorous, and that was an accptance of the prinproductive, and with immense resources, ciple of protection. Would anyone deny and they would be a source of strength that the wages of the workmen in Gerto this country as the competition of other nations became keener, as the in- many had advanced proportionately vasion of the home market became greater, greater than the wages of the working men and as the struggle of the nations enlarged. in England? During the years 1887 to For himself, he believed that the secret 1900 wages in England had advanced from of the future lay in the development of 81 to 100 per cent., whereas wages in the resources of those young countries. Germany had advanced from 78 to 100 If he were asked if they were to sacrifice per cent. That was an important anything for the Colonies he would say matter, as they had been challenged again no, because the struggle of the British and again on the question of wages. workman was great enough already, and the struggle of home industries was great enough. But the Colonies asked nothing for which they were not prepared to give a quid pro quo. They were willing to give this country the corn it needed, and to purchase from this country goods. which they now obtained from other

And, it being Midnight, the debate stood adjourned.

Debate to be resumed To-morrow.

Adjourned at one minute after
Twelve o'clock.

An Asterisk (*) at the commencement of

a

Speech indicates revision by the Member.

HOUSE OF LORDS.

Thursday, 11th February, 1904.

EARLDOM OF NORFOLK.

Petition of Charles Botolph Joseph Lord Mowbray, Lord Segrave, and Baron and Lord Stourton of Stourton in the county of Wiltshire, praying for leave to lodge a supplementary case; read, and ordered as prayed.

LE POWER AND COROGHMORE BARONY.

to the

Petition of Edmond de le Poer of Gurteen le Poer, in the county of Waterford, Esquire (claiming to be Baron of Le Power and Coroghmore in the Peerage of Ireland), to His Majesty, praying that His Majesty may be graciously pleased to give directions the Attorney-General in Ireland to investigate the Petitioner's pedigree and his right to the succession to the dignity and honour of Baron of Le Power and Coroghmore in the Peerage of Ireland; and also as to the outlawry against John Power in or about the year 1691, in order that the same may be reversed if found to affect the Petitioner; and, if not, that then the Petitioner may be admitted to the full enjoyment of the ancient dignity and honour of his ancestors as Baron Le Power and Coroghmore, with all the rights, privileges, and immunities thereunto belonging, or to make such other order in the premises as in His Majesty's wisdom may be deemed expedient, together with His Majesty's reference thereof to this House, and the report of the Attorney-General thereon, thereunto

annexed.

Presented [by Command], read, and referred to the Committee for Privileges to consider and report.

NEW PEER.

The Lord Romilly took the Oath.

SAT FIRST.

The Lord Wynford sat first in Parliament after the death of his kinsman. VOL. CXXIX. [FOURTH SERIES.]

PRIVATE BILL BUSINESS.

Elysée Palace Hotel Company Bill [H.L.]; Preston, Chorley, and Horwich Tramways Bill [H.L.]; referred to the Examiners.

RETURNS, REPORTS, ETC.

ROLL OF THE LORDS.

The LORD CHANCELLOR acquainted the House that the Clerk of the Parliaments had prepared and laid it on the Table. The same was ordered to be printed. (No. 7.)

AFRICA, No. 1 (1904).

Correspondence and Report from His Majesty's Consul at Boma respecting the administration of the Independent State of the Congo.

TRANSVAAL (LABOUR COMMISSION). I. Reports of the Transvaal Labour Commission.

II. Minutes of Proceedings and Evidence.

RAILWAY ACCIDENTS.
Returns of accidents and casualties as

reported to the Board of Trade by the several railway companies in the United Kingdom during the nine months ended 30th September, 1903, in pursuance of the Regulation of Railways Act (1871); together with reports of the inspecting officers, assistant inspecting officers, and sub-inspectors of the Railway Department to the Board of Trade, upon certain accidents which were inquired into.

LIGHT RAILWAYS ACT, 1896.

I. Orders made by the Light Railway Commissioners, and modified and confirmed by the Board of Trade, authorising the construction of light railways in: the borough of Maidstone, in the county of Kent; the parishes of Acton, Edgware, Edmonton, Enfield, Finchley, Friern Barnet, Hendon, Hornsey, Little Stanmore, Southgate, Tottenham, Wembley, Willesden, and Wood Green, in the county of Middlesex; the parish of Watford Urban and the urban district of 2 M

Watford, in the county of Hertford; the urban districts of Quarry Bank, Brierley Hill, and Rowley Regis, in the county of Stafford.

II. An Order made by the Light Railway Commissioners, and confirmed by the Board of Trade, amending the Robertsbridge and Pevensey Light Railway Order, 1900.

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Presented (by Command), and ordered to lie on the Table.

COMMITTALS (IRELAND). Returns from the Clerks of the Crown and Peace of the number of persons committed for trial in 1903.

SUMMARY PROCEEDINGS (ENGLAND). Rule, dated 30th December, 1903, made by the Lord Chancellor under Section 29 of the Summary Jurisdiction Act, 1879, as to the taking of recognisances by the governor of a prison.

SEA FISHERIES REGULATION ACT, 1888. Order, made by the Board of Agriculture and Fisheries under the provisions of the Act, for the variation of the Order creating the Southern Sea Fisheries District.

SUPERANNUATION.

Treasury Minute, dated 4th February, 1904, declaring that Charles Dyer, Royal Small Arms Factory, Enfield, was appointed without a civil service certificate through inadvertence on the part of the head of his Department.

DUCHY OF CORNWALL.

An account of the receipts and disbursements of the Duchy of Cornwall in the year ended the 31st December, 1903.

PENAL SERVITUDE ACTS, 1853 TO 1891

(CONDITIONAL LICENCE). Licence granted by His Majesty to Florence Elizabeth Maybrick, under the provisions of the Penal Servitude Acts, 1853 to 1891, to which is annexed a condition other than those contained in Schedule A of the Penal Servitude Act, 1864.

POOR PRISONERS DEFENCE ACT, 1903 (DRAFT RULES).

Draft rules proposed to be made by the

the Lord Chancellor and the Secretary of State for the Home Department, in pursuance of Section 2 of the Act.

COMPANIES (WINDING-UP).

General rules made pursuant to the Companies (Winding-up) Act, 1890, and the Judicature Act, 1881.

PILOTAGE.

Abstract of returns relating to pilots and pilotage in the United Kingdom (in continuation of Parliamentary Paper, No. 312, of session of 1902), as furnished by the various pilotage authorities.

LIFE ASSURANCE COMPANIES. Statements of accounts and of life assurance and annuity business and abstracts of actuarial reports deposited with the Board of Trade, under Section 10 of the Life Assurance Companies Act, 1870, during the year ended 31st December, 1903.

Laid before the House (pursuant to Act), and ordered to lie on the Table.

BANK OF ENGLAND.

Applications made by the First Lord of the Treasury and the Chancellor of Deputy Governor of the Bank of England the Exchequer to the Governor and for advances to Government authorised to 5th January, 1094; delivered (pursuant by Parliament, from 5th January, 1903, to Act), and ordered to lie on the Table.

BIRMINGHAM BISHOPRIC.

Petition in favour of legislation for the the President and Members of the creation of a new See of Birmingham; of Worcester Diocesan Conference; read, and ordered to lie on the Table.

NEW BILL.

LOCAL AUTHORITIES (QUALIFICATION OF WOMEN) BILL [H.L.].

A Bill to enable women to be elected and act as members of county and borough councils and metropolitan borough councils was presented by the Earl Beauchamp; read 1"; and to b

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