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Mr. GILLETT. You could install a sprinkling apparatus which would not be very expensive!

Col. Harts. We have that now in the little building which was erected in the court of the State, War, and Navy Department Building. We have a sprinkler service that we think will prevent that building injuring the main building in case of fire.

Mr. ROOSEVELT. Even with a sprinkling system, a fire at the present time would put entirely out of commission all the bureau records.

The CHAIRMAN. None of these buildings is fireproof?

Mr. ROOSEVELT. I would rather be in a concrete building than a wooden building.

Admiral HARRIS. It confines the fire to one floor.
Mr. GILLETT. Sprinklers would confine it closely.
Mr. ROOSEVELT. Unless a big fire should get started at night.

As far as we are concerned, we look at it a little this way: You put up a temporary building and it will cost you about $2 a square foot to erect it, and you have a purely temporary building. Under this lease arrangement you will get the space for about 50 cents a square foot. You can lease it for three years for the same amount of money that you could build a temporary building. The temporary building would have to come down at the end of the war. In this way we get permanent quarters, which we will probably continue to occupy after the war is over or until Congress gives us a new building

The CHAIRMAN. You certainly do not expect to have the same organization after the war is over?

Mr. ROOSEVELT. No; and we do not expect to return to the old prewar organization, either.

WEDNESDAY, JULY 25, 1917.

NAVY ANNEX (ARLINGTON BUILDING), SALARIES OF EMPLOYEES AND

EXPENSES OF HEATING, LIGHTING, ETC.

STATEMENT OF COL. W. W. HARTS, OFFICER IN CHARGE OF

PUBLIC BUILDINGS AND GROUNDS.

The CHAIRMAN. Col. Harts, it is estimated that it will cost $90,000 to operate that building.

Col. HARTS. Yes, sir; about that for six months. My estimates were $90,000 for the pay roll of the employees on the year basis and $92,000 for fuel, light, and incidental expenses, elevator ropes, wiring, and various other things. I have with me all the details on which this estimate is based, should you desire them. I might say that this estimate is based on the present cost of maintenance of the State, War, and Navy Department building, with certain modifications which we find will be different in this new building. For example, we can reduce the cost of personnel probably very much lower than in the State, War, and Navy Building, but the cost of fuel and light will be very much greater.

The CHAIRMAN. Why?

Col. Harts. The State, War and Navy Building is a very economical building as far as heat and light are concerned. We get the heat practically for nothing, as it is a by-product of the lighting by exhaust steam from the lighting plant is used for heating. Our electricity we make for between 1 and 2 cents a kilowat hour. We will have to pay 3 cents at this new building from private commercial plants. Fuel for this new building will now cost $6 a ton. The cost of fuel at the State, War, and Navy Building gives us the heat as a by-product practically for nothing as the fuel for the lighting covers the heat as well. The cost of fuel and light at the new building probably will be very much greater. The cost of personnel will be less, because of several things. The new building is very much higher, the floor space on each floor much less, and the watching and caring of the building will therefore be cheaper. There are only three entrances proposed, whereas in the State, War, and Navy Building there are more than three times that number. Patrolling and protecting the floors and corridors of the State, War, and Navy Department Building requires a larger force than this building will require. We can therefore reduce the watch force from 70 in the State, War, and Navy Department Building to 30. As to a comparison of space, there are 300,000 square feet in the Ştate, War, and Navy Building and 420,000 square feet in the new Arlington Building.

The CHAIRMAN. The gross space.

Col. HARTS. Yes; in both cases. There are about 679 rooms in the State, War, and Navy Building and although there are no partitions in place, there would be something over 800 rooms; probably 850 rooms in the Arlington Building.

Mr. SHERLEY. Could you not use the same system of heating and lighting!

Col. Harts. They have their own plant in the building for heating and the light we will have to buy from the city supply.

Mr. SHERLEY. I am wondering. You say you have a plant over in the old building by which you get your heat as a by-product, why not have that in this building?

Čol. Harts. I am advised that they asked the owners of the building if they would put in their own plant, but they refused. They said that they could not afford to do it, without a greatly increased rental.

Mr. SHERLEY. It would be a matter of economy to them in the long run?

Col. Harts. When they take this building over they might then put in their own system, and they can then put in a more modern system. This system would be used up pretty well by that time.

The CHAIRMAN. How much will it cost to put in that plant?

Col. Harts. It will cost at least $60,000 for boilers, and probably cost in the neighborhood of $100,000 for dynamos and installation for the production of electricity.

The CHAIRMAN. You now light and heat the Navy Annex ?
Col. Harts. Yes, sir.
The CHAIRMAN. You will continue to do that?
Col. HARTS. Yes, sir.

Mr. Caxxox. Can not you heat the building from the central plant?

Col. HARTS. No; because we have no ducts, and the legislation does not permit furnishing heat to any rented building. Further, the central heating and lighting plant will not be in operation for some years.

Mr. CANxox. What are ducts? Col. Harts. The underground conduits for heat pipes. Mr. CANNON. You would only have to lay them from the vicinity of the White House?

Col. Harts. Yes, sir. That would also mean additional capacity at the central plant to supply the extra power and light.

Mr. Cannon. Are they fully loaded!

Col. HARTS. I think every time an additional building has been added to the list of those to be heated they have asked for an increase in their capacity of plant.

Mr. Canxox. Would not that be cheaper than an independent plant! If you rent it for 3 years you will probably rent it for 25 years.

Col. HARTS. That is the question-if it is going to be rented for a long time it would probably be wise, but if only for a few years it is a question whether the saving in cost would pay to put the ducts into that building. That is a matter which can be decided by calculation, depending on what it costs and how long a time the building is to be rented.

WEDNESDAY, JULY 25, 1917. NAVAL ESTABLISHMENT,

CIVILIAN NAVAL CONSULTING BOARD.

STATEMENT OF CAPT. W. S. SMITH, UNITED STATES NAVY.

EXPENSES.

The CHAIRMAN. "For actual expenses incurred by and in connection with the Civilian Naval Consulting Board, fiscal year 1918, $25,000.” You have an appropriation of $25,000 now? Capt. SMITH. Yes, sir.

The CHAIRMAN. What is the necessity for any more money at this time?

Capt. SMITH. The expenses in May and June averaged about $3,526, and for 12 months that would be $42,312.

The CHAIRMAN. How do they expend this money? Capt. SMITH. They spend it in going to meetings of the boardcommittee meetings, for experiments, watching over experiments, etc.

The CHAIRMAN. Can we get a detailed statement of their expenditures? Of course, they would not need any money now before December, anyway.

Capt. SMITH. No, sir. The office in New York is now spending about $900 a month. The Chicago office is spending $300 a month. It costs $500, but the Chicago people are putting up $200 a month.

The CHAIRMAN. We would like to have a detailed statement of their expenditures in the months of May and June.

Capt. SMITH. All right, sir.
The CHAIRMAN. What act authorized the creation of this board?

Capt. Smith. The only one I know of is the naval appropriation act approved August 29, 1916.

The CHAIRMAN. That was just an appropriation bill.
Capt. SMITH. Yes.
The CHAIRMAN. There was no authority in there to establish it.
Was there any other authority?

Capt. SMITH. None that I know of.
The CHAIRMAN. Have you the personnel of the board?
Capt. SMITH. I can send it to you.

The CHAIRMAN. Send that and also a detailed statement of their expenditures for May and June.

NAVAL CONSULTING BOARD.

Addicks, Lawrence, 126 Liberty Street, New York City; residence, Elizabeth,

N. J. Arnold, Bion J., 105 South Lasalle Street, Chicago, Ill. Baekeland, Dr. L, H., Harmony Park, Yonkers, N, Y. Coffin, Howard E., 29 West Thirty-ninth Street, New York City. Craven, Alfred, 375 Park Avenue, Yonkers, N. Y. Edison, Thomas A., Edison Laboratory, Orange, N. J.; residence, Llewellyn

Park, West Orange, Emmet, William LeRoy, General Electric Co., Schenectady, N. Y. Hewitt, Dr. Peter Cooper, Madison Square Garden Tower, Twenty-sixth Street,

New York City; residence, 11 Lexington Avenue, New York City. Hunt, Andrew Murray, 55 Liberty Street, New York City ; residence, 549 River

side Drive, New York City. Hutchison, Dr. M. R., Edison Laboratory, Orange, N. J.; residence, Llewellyn

Park, West Orange. Lamme, B. G., chief engineer, Westinghouse Electric & Manufacturing Co., East

Pittsburgh, Pa. Maxim, Hudson, Maxim Park, Landing, N. J.; 698 St. Marks Avenue, Brook

lyn, N. Y. Miller, Spencer, 96 Liberty Street, New York City; residence, 217 Turrell

Avenue, South Orange, N. J. Richards, Dr. Joseph W., Lehigh University, South Bethelem, Pa. Riker, Andrew L., Locomobile Co. of America, Bridgeport, Conn. ; residence,

Fairfield, Conn. Robins, Thomas, 13 Park Row, New York City; residence, Saddle Rock House,

Shippan Point, Stamford, Conn. Saunders, W. L., 11 Broadway, New York City; residence, 112 Rockview Avenue,

North Plainfield, N. J.
Sellers, Matthew Bacon, 801 North Arlington Avenue, Baltimore, Md.
Sperry, Elmer A., 126 Nassau Street, Brooklyn, N. Y.; residence, 100 Marlboro

Road, New York City.
Sprague, Frank J., 165 Broadway, New York City ; residence, 241. West End

Avenue, New York City,
Thayer, Benjamin B., 42 Broadway, New York City; residence, 46 Fast Seventy-

ninth Street, New York City.
Webster, Dr. Arthur G., Clark University, Worcester, Mass.
Whitney, Dr. W. R., General Electric Co., Schenectady, N. Y.
Woodward, Dr. Robert S., Carnegie Institution of Washington, Washington,

D. C.

Officers: President, Thomas A. Edison; chairman, W. L. Saunders; secretary, Thomas Robins.

NAVY DEPARTMENT,

Washington, August 10, 1917.
From: Capt. W. S. Smith, United States Navy, Navy Department.
To: The chairman of Appropriations Committee, House of Representatives.
Subject: Detail of expenses of Naval Consulting Board for months of May

and June, 1917.
1. In compliance with instructions, the following is submitted :

May.

June. Amount expended for travel of members in attending

meetings of board, meetings of committees, and individual travel on experimental work---

$1,509.07 $1, 605. 89 Amount expended on telegrams, telephone, and registration postage --

22. 57 46.90 Amount expended on clerical work in office in New York. 425. 75 540.00 Amount expended in office supplies for whole board, May and June -

441. 94 Amount expended in office furniture outfit, including

typewriting machines, duplicating outfits for form letters, and printing circulars

137.59 3,525. 70 Investigating and test of Stevens submarine bomb net-- 1, 769.99 Investigation on submarine detection and other research

work of a confidential nature other than by members of the board, assistance of scientists..

223. 69 156. 31 Expenses of board meeting, French and English and Italian scientists -

99, 70 Night watchman for guarding confidential papers..

13. 50 The last of May the Park Row Realty Co. gave the use of a suite of offices on the fourteenth floor of 13 Park Row, New York City (six office rooms and two large desk and filing rooms). Six well-known consulting engineers of experience in mechanical and electrical work have given their services as assistants to the Secretary in examination and investigation of inventions and ideas submitted for the benefit of the Government.

The cost of fitting up these offices with furniture, typewriting machines, duplicating machines for form letters, and office fixtures is a very large part of the expenditure for June.

In June an office was established in Chicago to relieve the offices in Washington and New York from a great deal of the work in the West and Northwest and to lessen the expenses of many living near and west of Chicago who preferred to personally call and discuss their ideas. The State Council of National Defense provided office room, and the expenses of the office is estimated at $500 monthly for the present fiscal year. Two hundred dollars of this, however, is subscribed, leaving $300 to be paid from the appropriation. The estimated expenses of the New York office for clerical force, tele

phone expenses, lighting, and all service (based on July expense) is, per month

$1,200 The total estimated expenses of the board is, per month, with no provision for emergencies.

3, 350 A yearly estimate --

40, 200 W. STROTHER SMITH.

THURSDAY, JULY 26, 1917.

BUREAU OF NAVIGATION-RECREATION OF ENLISTED MEN.

STATEMENT OF COMMANDER L. M. OVERSTREET.

The CHAIRMAN. For “Recreation for enlisted men” you are asking $250,000. What is proposed to be done with this amount?

Commander OVERSTREET. Previous to the war the men on the battleships and the men at the four regular training stations pro

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