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we should put this off until after the war; then for another year after that we would still be without the maps.

Mr. SHERLEY. I just want to feel satisfied that the doing of this work is not going to interfere with your supply of men for doing the more important mapping work abroad.

Gen. BLACK. No; it will not interfere with that.

Mr. CANNON. Just at that point let me ask this question: France and Great Britain have, no doubt, had maps made through their aviators, and can not the allies make more accurate maps than could be made by our employees after they get over there?

Gen. BLACK. No, sir. The men who are going over there are to map the country where the English and French have not been able to do it; country that has been occupied by other people; in other words, the men going over there for this purpose will be used in territory in which no one is working just now except the Germans.

Mr. Cannon. That is, it will be an enlargement of the Aviation Corps there and the doing of work in the enemy's country?

Gen. BLACK. Yes. Before they make an assault now they take base maps made by the French in times of peace, and they are very good; then they reinforce those by the results of the work of the aviators and make a battle map; they place on that all the lines that the aviators can find of the German entrenchments, sometimes doing it so closely as to make a relief map of it. Then that is studied before the grand assault is made, so that each division or each regiment knows absolutely just what it is going into. That means that the scale is vastly increased. The original maps from which they work are usually not over an inch to the mile; those maps can be increased in scale to 12 and even 24 inches to the mile, and then added to that is the information gained from the aviation reconnaissance; then a relief map is made for the study of the troops, so that they will know just what they are going into.

Mr. CANNON. Then that would involve cooperation, because when you get over there, I take it, the whole thing is coordinated, the French and Americans are substantially mixed up together?

Gen. BLACK. No, sir.

Mr. CANNON. I know they are under separate commands, but after all they are along the same lines?

Gen. BLACK. No, sir.

Mr. Cannox. Therefore, when the French have no maps, it is necessary to make new or additional ones?

Gen. Black. Yes, sir: they will take the base maps and do exactly what the French are doing for their people when they make an attack; they will do exactly for our people what the French are doing for their people. I just want to say to Mr. Sherley that whether the country should be mapped this year or next year is a question of judgment, and that you gentlemen are just as capable of forming that judgment as I am. But the fact is that we have nothing at present. We do not need it now, but when we will need it I do not know. That is just the point I wanted to make there.

Mr. Cannon. You would need these maps if an invading army would attempt to land here?

Gen. Black. Not only then, sir, but if the German fleet ever got out we would need them for the use of our aviators as a protection against their invading aviators.

ENGINEER EQUIPMENT OF TROOPS.

The CHAIRMAN. The next item is engineer equipment of troops. You have had about $37,000,000! Gen. BLACK. Yes, sir. The CHAIRMAN. And you are asking an additional $1,300,000? Gen. BLACK. Yes, sir. The CHAIRMAN. Will you state, first, General, what is being done with the appropriations heretofore made? We gave you about $37,000,000, and my recollection is that was for the necessary equipment of an army of a million men.

Gen. BLACK. Yes, sir; in the urgent deficiency act there was appropriated $35,876,000.

The CHAIRMAN. And in the Army act $1,174,000, making about $37,000,000 all told?

Gen. BLACK. Yes, sir; that has been spent in part. We have a total unallotted of about $36,000,000, but it is all required for the purposes for which it was appropriated, namely, the National Army, but in addition to the National Army that we knew of then there have been these calls for special troops of which we knew nothing: Four railway-operating regiments, 5 railway-construction regiments, 2 shop regiments, 4 road-building battalions. 8 construction battalions, 6 topographical sections, 3 map-reproduction detachments, 10 supply-depot detachments, 6 water-supply companies, 6 forestry regiments, from 32 to 40 work companies that is, 250 men in each; we call them service companies in order to try to make them a little more popular), 6 mining companies, 4 fortifications battalions, 5 electrical regiments, and 5 inland-waterway companies. Those are all called for by Gen. Pershing and are the results of cable messages. Now, even these are not quite correct, because we have cable messages which make changes in some minor particulars, but the number is not decreased at all.

The CHAIRMAN. The organizations you have enumerated require equipment ? Gen. BLACK. Yes, sir. The CHAIRMAN. And this is to provide the engineer equipment?

Gen. BLACK. Yes; for those additional organizations that have been authorized and called for by Gen. Pershing since the other estimate was made and submitted.

The CHAIRMAN. Are they submitted under the provisions of the national-defense act authorizing technical units!

Gen. BLACK. Yes, sir. The CHAIRMAN. You ask that this be available until June 30, 1919. Do you expect to spend it this fiscal year or what portion of it between now and that time?

Gen. Black. That will depend on how fast we can get these troops out. I can not find out how fast they want them over there. However, the major part of it will be spent this fiscal year, but there may be a portion of it, the re-equipment, that may go on over.

Maj. GRANT. We think that most of it will be spent this year; it depends a little on how fast we can get troops over there.

Gen. BLACK. I am sorry to tell you that the more cables that come from France the more I find I am deficient.

The CHAIRMAN. This is what I have in mind: We are trying to find out how much money will be needed during this fiscal year and then to carry moneys for the next fiscal year in the appropriation bill for next year. If you believe that this is to be expended this year you do not need this additional language and if it is not to be expended this year you do not need the money.

Gen. BLACK. No, sir; but we believe it will be expended this year.

PER DIEM IN LIEU OF SUBSISTENCE FOR CIVILIAN EMPLOYEES.

The CHAIRMAN. You are asking authority to pay a per diem of $4 in lieu of subsistence?

Gen. Black. That is required to be repeated in each act under the law; there is nothing new in that.

The CHAIRMAN. You never had it before?
Gen. BLACK. Yes, sir.
Mr. SHERLEY. They always asked it but never got it.
Gen. BLACK. No, sir; we have been having it.
The CHAIRMAN. There is a law-

That the heads of executive departments and other Government establishinents are authorized to prescribe per diem rates of allowance not exceeding $4 in lieu of subsistence to persons engaged in field work for traveling on official business outside of the District of Columbia and away from their designated posts of duty when not otherwise fixed by law.

Gen. BLACK. Go on and read a little further.
The CHAIRMAN (reading):

For the fiscal year 1916 and annually thereafter estimates of appropriations from which per diem accounts are to be paid shall specifically state the rates of such allowances.

Gen. Black. That is all it is just to comply with the law.

The CHAIRMAX. But you did not have it in the previous appropriations, although perhaps I am under a misapprehension?

Gen. BLACK. I think you are.
The ('HAIRMAX. Do officers of your corps get per dienı allowances!

Gen. BLACK. No, sir; they do not get a per diem allowance. That is for our civilian employees.

The CHAIRMAN. This is merely to take care of your civilian employees? Gen. BLACK. Yes, sir.

MOTOR CYCLES. Mr. SHERLEY. How much of this do you expect to spend for motor cycles? You had a limitation before touching the purchase of motor cycles which you are asking to be removed.

Gen. BLACK. Yes, sir; because we are trying to conform exactly to what they send us word from France they need. For example. we are not sending the horses of the mounted sections of engineers over there, and in lieu of that we are sending some more motor cycles. They can not forage the horses.

The Chairman. When you use motor cycles, do you use the ones with an outrigger?

Gen. BLACK. Yes, sir; so as to carry tools or anything else we want to carry.

The CHAIRMAN. That is the type which is mostly used now, is it? Gen. Black. Yes, sir. Mr. SHERLEY. You did not state how much you expected to spend for motor cycles.

Maj. GRANT. The limited number of 78 was to provide for the three regular regiments only, and we are expecting to continue the same proportion in the new regiments, but we do not know exactly how many regiments are going to be raised. A number of motor cycles constitute a part of the equipment of each regiment.

Mr. SHERLEY. General, I see that I was mistaken. The language in italics is what was in the Army act, and when we appropriated last June we left out any limitation touching motor cycles, probably for the reason you have indicated.

Gen. BLACK. Yes, sir. We are changing a great many items of equipment.

DELIVERY OF EQUIPMENT. Mr. SHERLEY. I understand that. What I would like to know is how you are getting along in supplying this equipment.

Gen. BLACK. We have met every demand so far, I believe.

Maj. Grant. Yes, sir; everything but searchlights has been 100 per cent ready at all times, and the first regiment that is going over has a full equipment of searchlights.

Mr. SHERLEY. Of course, comparatively speaking, you have had small demands made on you?

Gen. BLACK. Yes, sir.

Mr. SHERLEY. What I have in mind is the situation that confronts you in the future. The $37,000,000, approximately, which you had, and this $4,300,000 you are now asking for is what you contemplate to have to expend for your equipment of the troops that go with 1,000,000 men?

Gen. BLACK. Yes, sir.

Mr. SHERLEY. Now, what I want to know is whether you are going to be able to supply this material in the quantities necessary as fast as the different regiments are raised?

Gen. Black. I think we will have no difficulty. We have been quite fortunate in being ahead on our contracts, and so far as I know we will have no trouble.

Maj. GRANT. Yes, sir; almost everything in this first supplementary estimate will be delivered before the 15th of this month.

Mr. SHERLEY. What do you mean by that—that you will spend this $37,000,000 this month

Maj. Grant. No; all the original equipment included in that asti. mate will have been delivered by the middle of this month.

Mr. SHERLEY. I do not understand what you mean by origing equipment.

Maj. GRANT. The total sum estimated includes both the original equipment and the replacement equipment and additional recruit equipment during the year.

Mr. SHERLEY. In other words, the original equipment for your 1,000,000 men you expect to have delivered in the course of a month?

Maj. GRANT. Yes, sir; except searchlights and wagons.

Mr. SHERLEY. And that to be followed by the amount necessary for your reserve for the 1,000,000 men and for the support.

4400_-17-24

Gen. BLACK. The replacement.
Mr. SHERLEY. That is what I mean by the word “support."

The CHAIRMAN. Have you included anything for an additional army of 1,000,000 men! Gen. BLACK. No, sir; I do not think we have.

METHOD PURSUED IN OBTAINING MATERIALS. Mr. SHERLEY. How are you buying this material? Gen. BLACK. Under contract, in the usual way.

Mr. SHERLEY. You have not changed your usual method of obtaining it?

Gen. BLACK. No, sir.
Mr. SHERLEY. You advertise for bids?

Gen. BLACK. We limit the time of advertisement, and in case of special things like searchlights we simply go to the firms and get proposals from the firms manufacturing them, without long advertisement.

The Chairman. Is that because there are a limited number of manufacturers?

Gen. BLACK. Yes, sir. For instance, take the item of movable searchlights. I think there are only three firms in the United States prepared to furnish them at all, and the first ones we got were manufactured by a firm that had manufactured them for the Russians. We took them over instead of letting them go to Russia. The others are being manufactured by the Sperry people and by the General Electric people.

The CHAIRMAN. The great bulk of your purchases, however, are made on competitive bids after advertisement ?

Gen. BLACK. Yes, sir. Mr. SHERLEY. Have you availed yourselves at all of the services of the Council of National Defense, or are you working just as you did in former times?

Gen. BLACK. We have tried to avail ourselves of the services of the Council of National Defense.

Mr. SHERLEY. Well, what did you do?

Gen. BLACK. We have been able to supply ourselves economically and expeditiously without recourse to those various committees.

Mr. SHERLEY. General, you say you have been able to supply yourselves economically. In point of fact, how are your prices running with prices for similar material prior to the war?

Gen. BLACK. They are higher. Locomotives, I think, have gone up. I did not look at these prices before I came down here, Mr. Sherley, but I think locomotives that we could have bought for about $23,000 we are now paying from $40,000 to $45,000 for.

Mr. SHERLEY. You never bought locomotives before?

Gen. BLACK. I have not; no, sir; but Mr. Felton has, and he happened to tell me about it.

Mr. SHERLEY. Did he buy some in connection with the Mexican situation?

Gen. BLACK. No, sir; he had bought them for his own railroad. Mr. SHERLEY. I mean, the Government has never bought them?

Gen. Black. Not in any large amount; no, sir; nothing but very small construction locomotives. We have never bought any of the full-size locomotives.

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