for each month since the breaking out of war. We did this with the same force, and we did it by improving in every possible way the efficiency of the force and the methods that we were using, as well as by curtailing the leave of our employees. But now we find ourselves simply overwhelmed by the volume of the work coming in; we can not even keep it current by denying leave to the employees. In addition to that we have an increasing sick list. One of the peculiarities of our division is that we employ a large number of ladies, and the ages of the ladies doing this counting may be of interest to you, in that 37 per cent of them are over 50 years of age, 20 per cent are over 60 years of age, and 10 per cent are over 70 years of age. Yet we have to deny leave to these ladies, who sit there day by day and count this old, worn, and evil-smelling money. It is a heartless task to force them to do it, and yet we have done that in order to try to keep this work current for the banks.

Mr. BYRNS. How do you account for such a large increase?

Mr. GATES. Whenever there is an increase in the business of the country we feel it at once. Whenever you have a good many more people wearing out money, by having it constantly in circulation, that money comes right back to our division. We are intimately in touch with the business of the banks of the country from one end to the other.

Mr. BYRNS. You are asking for 15 counters?

Mr. GATES. Yes.

Mr. BYRNS. How many have you now?

Mr. GATES. Eighty-four, with an average of probably 12 sick of the 84. In doing this work we are using counters who really belong to the laundry bureau. We handle the laundry machines in our office and we have had to shut them down in order to take advantage of the services of these women who ordinarily count the laundered money on the common redemption work. The laundry work is now some 20 days behind and our redemption work will average, perhaps, about two days behind.

Mr. BYRNS. That is practically current, is it not?

Mr. GATES. No. If I would bring the laundry work up so that it was nearly current, our redemption work would not be anywhere near current. I am holding in stock over $6,00,000 worth of notes that have been saved out of the mutilated notes for the laundry. Those notes are urgently needed now in circulation. The cashier is asking for them in order to put them in circulation, and we ought to have them there.

Mr. BYRNS. I thought that all of the laundry work was being done at the subtreasuries?

Mr. GATES. No, sir; all of the subtreasuries, or rather some of them, have laundries, but this is work done right here in the Treasurer's office. As these old notes come in we pick out the notes still fit for circulation and set them aside and launder them. I would call this to your attention, that if we are to hold this work anywhere nearly current it must be done by not giving these women their leave and without having them lose a minute in their work on any day, and the force can not stand it because of their age and their condition.

Mr. BYRNS. Several of you gentlemen have referred to the question of leave. Leave is dated from the beginning of the fiscal year, and the 30 days' leave must be taken during the fiscal year?

Mr. GATES. No; from January to January with us.

Mr. BYRNS. The calendar year?

Mr. GATES. Yes, sir.

Mr. BYRNS. Do I understand that none of the clerks which you and the other gentlemen have spoken about have had any leave since January?

Mr. GATES. Here and there are isolated cases, where the situation was such that it absolutely demanded it, but, as a general rule. they have had only a day now and then when absolutely necessary, and, as a matter of fact, I have not had a time in a week since the 1st of January when I felt authorized to give extended leave to any of my clerks.

Mr. ELLIOTT. I would like to say, in regard to the clerks in my division, that before the war broke out quite a number of them got a portion of their leave; none of them got their full leave, but quite a number of them got a portion of their leave. However, since the war broke out and we had to curtail the leave they have gotten no more leave, although, as Mr. Allen stated a moment ago, the summer months is the time when most of the clerks take their vacations.

BOOKKEEPING SECTION-ADDITIONAL CLERKS.

Mr. BYRNS. Now, 10 more clerks are asked for?

Mr. WARNER. The section of bookkeeping of the Division of General Accounts asks for four, the warrant section of the same division asks for four, and the cashier asks for two; this, of course, owing to the work having increased, just like it has increased in the other divisions the natural growth and the extraordinary growth on account of war conditions.

Mr. BYRNS. Just state what class of clerks you desire?

Mr. WARNER. The chief of the warrant section asks for 3 clerks, at $1,200, and 1 typist, at $900; the bookkeeping section asks for 1 clerk, at $1,600, and 3, at $1,200; and the cashier asks for 2, at $1,200. Mr. BYRNS. With reference to the four clerks in the bookkeeping section, why is it you need them?

Mr. WARNER. The ordinary increase in the work and the extraordinary increase on account of the war. That is the division where they prepare the daily statement of the condition of the Treasury, which is very intricate and requires very high-grade bookkeepers. A clerk at $1.600 is needed for that high-grade work, and it would not be safe to intrust the average clerk with that kind of work-the kind of clerk we get for $1,200 per annum. I will say in this connection that there was one time, when they changed the form suddenly, that the chief, assistant chief, and one of the $1,600 clerks, a woman, worked from 8 o'clock until the following 8 o'clock the next morning, having their meals sent in to them. It is very intricate work, and if there would be an error made in that, it would be rather distressing, because it is scrutinized from one part of the country to the other, it being the daily statement as to the condition of the Treasury.

Mr. BYRNS. As I understand it, that work must be kept current? Mr. WARNER. Yes; they worked all night long, the three of them, two men and a woman.

Mr. BYRNS. Is that because they failed to get a balance?

Mr. WARNER. No; it was because a new form of statement had to be gotten out and it had to be issued the next day. But that is a frequent occurrence there that is, it is not infrequently that they work overtime.

Mr. BYRNS. Are you in the same condition that these other gentlemen say they are in with reference to leave?

Mr. WARNER. The whole office; yes. As I stated, there are only 4 on leave and 20 who are sick.

Mr. BYRNS. That applies to the whole office?

Mr. WARNER. Yes, sir; with the exception of the National Bank Redemption Agency, which is paid for by the banks.

Mr. BYRNS. You spoke of a new form of statement requiring them to work all night?

Mr. WARNER. Yes, sir.

Mr. BYRNS. Of course, that is behind you, so far as that is concerned?

Mr. WARNER. Oh, yes. I simply mentioned that to show you it is very important work. The form was changed on the order of the Secretary and it had to be put into effect at once. Mr. Allen is more familiar with the accounting section, and he could explain the details better than I can.

Mr. ALLEN. All of the accounts pass through the accounting division and the results are passed on to the principal bookkeeper, and he and his assistants prepare the daily statement. We sometimes pay 85,000 checks a day, and any delay in this work in getting a balance for the day causes a delay in his work. I am very familiar with the work there and I know that they need this extra force in order to keep up the work. The war work has increased this daily statement work in that they have to handle a great deal of their figures by telegrams, especially in relation to these Libery Loan propositions.

Mr. BYRNS. What do you mean by telegrams?

Mr. ALLEN. Telegraphic reports, coming in from Federal reserve banks as to what they have done on the sale of the bonds, certificates of indebtedness, and so on. Those reports are frequently telegraphed in so that the daily statement may be kept current.

Mr. WARNER. I do not think it has been stated, but there are about 4,000 Government disbursing officers' accounts which have to be stated, and I think they are coming in at the rate of about 25 a day. Mr. ALLEN. Yes; we are opening on an average of 25 new accounts every day.

Mr. BYRNS. On account of the war?

Mr. ALLEN. Yes, sir.

WARRANT DIVISION-ADDITIONAL CLERKS.

Mr. BYRNS. What about these four additional clerks for the warrant division?

Mr. WARNER. They are trying to borrow help all the time, and it simply robs one office to help another out; that is due to the fact that there has been a great increase in the work and an increase in the number of warrants issued. They are coming to my division frequently and borrowing help, and when they borrow from me it

puts me behind, and I have to skirmish around for help in some other place.

Mr. ALLEN. You know, all money appropriated by Congress is first set aside by warrants, and the number of warrants has increased very greatly, approximately in the same ratio that my work has increased, by reason of the war.

CASHIER'S OFFICE-ADDITIONAL CLERKS.

Mr. BYRNS. What is the occasion for the two clerks in the cashier's office?

Mr. WARNER. They have had a very large increase, and one increase that they had was on account of the great increase of currency that came from the Federal reserve banks at Atlanta and Richmond in connection with this war loan; they had to borrow five clerks from the agency and five clerks from the Loans and Currency Division and pay for them out of that liberty-loan fund. There has been a very heavy increase in the work.

Mr. BYRNS. Are these increases to which you refer, particularly in your division, the cashier's office, and the Warrant Division, going to be permanent, or are they to exist only during the war?

Mr. WARNER. I think they are going to last forever.

Mr. BYRNS. Or, I mean, during the issuance of these bonds?
Mr. ELLIOTT. The bonds are known as 15 and 30 year bonds.
Mr. BYRNS. I know, with reference to the interest.

Mr. ELLIOTT. And they will go on to 1932.

Mr. BYRNS. I appreciate that. What hours do you clerks work? Mr. WARNER. From 9 until 4.30.

Mr. BYRNS. Seven hours?

Mr. WARNER. Yes, sir. In some of the divisions they have to work until they balance, and in some of the divisions the volume of worklike in Mr. Allen's division, the Accounting Division-is such that that very frequently work overtime. But the rule is until 4.30.

Mr. CANNON. The Government is the principal stockholder in this farm-loan bank proposition, and I would like to ask whether that business runs through your office or whether it will run through your office?

Mr. WARNER. That has not affected us very much as yet.
Mr. CANNON. I know; but does it run through your office?

Mr. ALLEN. There is no appreciable work at all in connection with that.

Mr. CANNON. There is nothing to be audited?

Mr. ALLEN. No, sir.

Mr. CANNON. In other words, it is a corporation, and you do not have any more trouble with it than you do with the national banks? Mr. ALLEN. No, sir.

Mr. BYRNS. You stated that your clerks worked from 9 until 4.30? Mr. WARNER. Yes, sir.

Mr. BYRNS. As I understand it, the heads of departments have discretion to extend the hours? I know it has been done in the War Department, and I would like to ask you whether there has been any such extension of hours in the Treasury Department?

Mr. WARNER. No, sir. It has never been necessary to issue an order extending the hours; when the work becomes behind they just

simply work, and the chiefs of divisions do not ask the treasurer for an order to that effect, but they keep the clerks there until they balance, or as we did; we worked for eight months every night, every Sunday, and every holiday, but it was not necessary to issue any order. In the accounting division they are working now every Saturday half holiday.

Mr. GATES. The work in our division begins at half past 8 every morning, and very seldom do we close our vault until 5 o'clock in the afternoon.

Mr. BYRNS. That is in the redemption division?

Mr. GATES. Yes, sir.

Mr. CANNON. The Government is in the insurance business. Are there any reports that require auditing, etc., in that connection?

Mr. ELLIOTT. That is in the Bureau of War-Risk Insurance, which is a bureau under the Treasury Department. However, it does not affect the Treasurer's office, unless it be in regard to payments that may be made by checks drawn on the Treasury.

Mr. WARNER. It affects us in this way: We can send money by registered mail and insure for 2 cents up to $50 and 5 cents a thousand, so that if there is any money lost in transit this insurance company pays it. Prior to that the system was to send by registered mail, but you could not insure beyond $50, whereas now we can insure for any amount.

PURCHASE OF FURNITURE, ETC.

(See p. 9.)

Mr. BYRNS. The next item is "For the purchase of furniture, filing devices, typewriters, and labor-saving devices, including exchange and repairs, for use in the office of the Treasurer of the United States, $17,500."

Mr. ALLEN. In order to handle this large volume of work, very frequently as many as 80,000 checks a day, adding machines and devices that are used by the big banks in New York, Chicago, and other places are purchased. We have a large number of adding machines now, probably 35 or 40. and in order to handle the increase in work we will need from 30 to 50 per cent more adding machines. Instead of posting our accounts by hand we use the posting machines, and these checks have to be canceled when paid, and that is done by the use of check-canceling machines. We have two at the present time which we have had for two or three years. The volume of work has tremendously taxed the capacity of those machines; they are running all the time and are wearing out; we need one to take care of the increase in work, and we will need another to replace the extra strain on the two machines we have. Then we need tables, desks, and chairs for 30 clerks; then we use an addressograph, by which we save the labor of three typewriters; we need extra addressograph equipment; then we need filing equipment to file the checks and statements.

Mr. BYRNS. Then you want furniture, you say, for additional clerks?

Mr. ALLEN. Thirty clerks.

Mr. BYRNS. And filing cases?