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tion of the service, and they go over this aqueduct three or four times every day and the same number of times at night.

Mr. SHERLEY. Do they receive the same compensation?

Col. Fisk. Yes; but they are furnished this transportation, and that item called for $240 per month.

Mr. SHERLEY. What do you do—hire vehicles ?

Col. Fisk. We hire the horses and buggies, and we figured that was the cheapest way to do it. That enables them to make visits frequently enough to make sure that these men are attending to this work.

Mr. SHERLEY. An automobile could travel that road?

Col. Fisk. Yes, sir; but it would be more expensive to run and cost a great deal more.

Mr. SHERLEY. But you would need fewer men to do that work. Take a Ford machine at an initial cost of $700 or $800. Would it not be cheaper to have such a machine than to hire horses and buggies!

Col, Fisk. I do not believe it would.
Mr. SHERLEY. How many horses and buggies have you?

Col. Fisk. Four at $240 a month-$60 a month for each of those which I think is a very cheap price for them. We were able to put them in that service at that rate.

Mr. SHERLEY. They are just hired ?
Col. Fisk. Yes.
Mr. SHERLEY. You have no upkeep cost ?

Col. Fisk. No, sir; nothing at all; they are furnished to us at this net price, and they have to be kept in running order, and all that sort of thing.

REVOLVERS, AMMUNITION, Mr. SHERLEY. Have you a memorandum showing the amount expended for equipment?

Col. Fisk. Well, we have estimated on buying revolvers at a couple of hundred dollars, and some ammunition, $8; then we have furnished canvas coats amounting to $189, and canvas hats amounting to $199; the revolvers and ammunition we succeeded in getting from the Ordnance Department.

ETC.

GUARDS.

(See p. 712.) Mr. SHERLEY. Ilow long have you had these guards there?

Col. Fisk. The instructions from the Chief of Staff that I rereived were to take them over on the 5th of July, and we have had them since that time.

Mr. SHERLEY. This really is not only an estimate for the rest of the fiscal year but is a confirmation of action that has been taken heretofore?

Col. Fisk. Well, -of course, there are funds available for the aqneduct and these expenses have to be taken out of those funds, and we must look to this special appropriation to reimburse that appropriation.

Mr. STERLEY. The other fund was available for this purpose?
Col. Eisk. It was understood to be so; yes, sir.

Mr. SHERLEY. There is something like $6,000 that has not yet been accounted for!

Col. Fisk. Wages have been increased everywhere, and we do not know how long we will be able to keep these men at this price, so we put in a little extra in order to provide a margin. It will not be used unless necessary. As long as we can keep the men at this price we shall be glad to do

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THURSDAY, AUGUST 16, 1917.

DEPARTMENT OF AGRICULTURE.

STATEMENT OF MR. R. M. REESE, CHIEF CLERK.

PAYMENT OF RENT IN THE DISTRICT OF COLUMBIA.

The CHAIRMAN. You are asking $15,000 for rent, and this $15,000 is to be expended out of the appropriation carried in the act approved August 10, 1917, entitled "An act to provide further for the national security and defense by stimulating agriculture and facilitating the distribution of agricultural products. This $15,000 for rent in the District of Columbia is to be paid out of an appropriation of $650,000. What is the necessity for this?

Mr. REESE. The department normally is crowded, Mr. Chairman, and this additional appropriation, or the total carried by the bill, is over $11,000,000. That will require some increase in the force, unquestionably. Particularly, it will be necessary to increase the force in the Division of Publications, engaged on the enlarged informational work of the department, for which special provision is made in this act, and, also, in the Bureau of Markets and the States Relations Service. For the food survey and other lines of work in the Bureau of Markets $2,522,000 is appropriated, and for the educational and demonstration work of the States Relations Service $4,348,400 is appropriated.

Those three units particularly will unquestionably require additional employees to carry out the law, to say nothing of the enlarged work on live stock, insects, and the procuring, storing, and furnishing of seeds. The normal condition of the Department of Agriculture is to be crowded for space, and we have no room in which to place these additional necessary employees.

The-CHAIRMAN, How much space do you expect to obtain for this amount?

Mr. REESE. It is difficult to say. If it is possible to rent cheap buildings in the immediate neighborhood of the Department of Agriculture, we will do so. Rents there will be low, and the amount of space which we can secure for $15,000 will be larger than if we have to rent quarters uptown.

The CHAIRMAN. What number of additional employees do you expect this to house?

Mr. REESE. The estimates were made by the bureaus. The Bureau of Markets alone has estimated for 70,000 square feet of floor space, but it is possible they will not need that much. The Chief of the Division of Publications has told me he expects to find it necessary to employ 25 or 30 additional employees, due to the increase in the informational work provided for in the act.

The CHAIRMAN. What is the total number of additional employees!

Mr. REESE. It is a little hard to give an absolutely definite statement, Mr. Chairman. These are estimates of what we shall need.

The CHAIRMAX. You either estimated it or it is simply a guess; I do not know which.

Mr. REESE. We estimated it. In May I called for estimates from the various units of the department.

The ('HAIRMAN. What is the total number of additional employees that it is estimated will be taken on?

Mr. REESE. In my opinion we shall have to have at least 150 additional employees. This is based upon a reasonable consideration of the square feet of floor space estimated for by the various bureaus.

The ChairmAN. How many square feet of floor space did you estimate on?

Mr. REESE. A conservative estimate of the square feet of floor space which will be required is about 35,000 square feet. That at least is as near as I can figure it.

THURSDAY, AUGUST 16, 1917.

DISTRICT OF COLUMBIA.

STATEMENT OF BRIG. GEN. JOHN G. D. KNIGHT, ENGINEER

COMMISSIONER.

PURCHASE OF TOOLS, EQUIPMENT, LIGHTING AND HEATING APPARATUS FOR

CENTRAL GARAGE.

The CHAIRMAN. General, you have submitted an estimate for $3,000 for the purchase of tools, equipment, lighting and heating apparatus for the central garage. The total appropriation was $35,000. What is the necessity for this $3,000?

Gen. Knight. The money appropriated purchased the land and will complete the building proper. It leaves undone the driveways into the garage, front and back. That would be one item. As regards heating, it was proposed to heat the building from the large plant that is being constructed by the Federal Government, but that will not be done for probably a year and a half, so we will have to make temporary provision. That we propose to do by making a pipe connection with the heating apparatus in the present District Building.

The CHAIRMAX. When will the building be finished!

Gen. KNIGHT. I suppose it ought to be finished in four to five months.

The CHAIRMAN. Where is it located ?

Gen. KNIGHT. Just diagonally across from the rear of the Municipal Building. The remaining item is for tools and the equipment of the building that were not covered by the original appropriation. The main expense will be, of course, for the heating.

The CHAIRMAX. Have you the details?

Gen. Knight. I have no details. The estimate submitted by the municipal architect gave no details as to the itemized cost.

NOTE.—The following details of estimate were submitted August 17, 1917 : Tools and equipment..

$700 Lighting fixtures

500 Heating and lighting connections with Municipal Building

1, 300 Paving driveways

500

Total

3,000

D.
Brigadier Generui, United States Army, retired,

Engineer Commissioner.

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(See p. 45.) The CHAIRMAX. For judgments against the District of Columbia you are asking $7,620.60. Can you tell us what these judgments are?

Gen. KNIGHT. One is for Joseph A. Turner, on account of an accident at Kenyon Place. This is a place that was being filled. There is an immense ravine on Kenyon Place, between Sixteenth and Eighteenth Streets, on the west side. It was being filled gradually, and part of it had been used by the public. There was a large plank put across on uprights to prevent persons from going over into this ravine. This person went along there one night in his automobile, struck this plank, knocking it away, and went on from there down into the ravine, and was badly damaged.

The CHAIRMAN. He recovered damages

Gen. KNIGHT. He got damages against the District. It was put before a jury. I think his claim was $35,000, but the award was $7,500.

The CHAIRMAX. Was an appeal taken?

Gen. KNIGHT. The corporation counsel and also the counsel defending the suit recommended that no appeal be taken, and the judge advised that the probabilities were that if an appeal was taken the damages given would be much greater.

The CHAIRMAN. The next is an item of $21.50 for costs, in favor of Athol H. Ellis.

Gen. Knight. That was a case where a person was brought up before the municipal court and took an appeal, and these are the costs recovered against the Government. I suppose in this Turner case the appropriation covers an indefinite amount for interest to date?

The CHAIRMAN, Yes.

FRIDAY, AUGUST 3, 1917. ORDNANCE DEPARTMENT.

STATEMENT OF BRIG. GEN. WILLIAM CROZIER.

GENERAL STATEMENT.

The CHAIRMAN. General, do you first wish to make a general statement showing what your estimates are based upon?

Gen. CROZIER. Yes: I would be glad to, Mr. Chairman.

The estimates concerning which I am coming before you this morning are for funds whose necessity has been made apparent by a study of the requirements of the war which it has been possible to make since the estimates upon which the appropriations in the act of June 15 were based were made. Some of these estimates might have been foreseen and undoubtedly would have been foreseen if there had been time for a thorough and prolonged study of the probable requirements of the war before the passage of the last appropriation act. But, of course, you understand that these estimates were for sums that we could see an immediate necessity for and could not be complete at that early stage of our prosecution of the war.

In addition to the incompleteness of the estimates resulting from a lack of time, we have had since those estimates were made opportunity for discussion of the necessary preparation with both the British and the French war missions, both of these commissions being composed both of officers of the military services of those two countries particularly who are familiar with the prosecution of the war and also of civilians who have been themselves personally and intimately engaged in supplying the war material with which the var is being fought. i third reason for presenting these estimates to you is that it is necessary to bring before you the preparations which have to be started now if we are going to be ready to supply with armament and ammunition troops which we not only have not yet commenced to raise but which we will probably not commence to raise until eight or nine months or a year shall have elapsed.

The estimates with which the Ordnance Department are concerned aggregate something like two and three-quarter billion dollars. Of this sum the greater part is required for artillery and artillery ammunition.

In the last appropriation act there was supposed to be provided for supplying with artillery and artillery ammunition, among other things, the army of approximately 1,000,000 men which is now in course of formation, including as the last contingent the men of the National Army who are expected to be called to the colors about September 1. The estimates which were submitted then and in accordance with which you made appropriations, were not sufficient for the purpose for which they were submitted for reasons which I will tell you presently. That is one reason for these large estimates for artillery and artillery ammunition which are now submitted. Another reason is that since the construction of artillery is a long process, and since it requires not only an early commencement of the actual manufacture of the forgings for guns and of the guns themselves, but also the erection of plants for making the forgings and plants for machining the guns, it is necessary to start a long way in advance of the time when it is necessary to supply the forces in this kind of fighting material. Therefore we have to think now of the troops who will need artillery a year or more from now.

As we will have something like 1,000,000 men under arms soon after the 1st of next September, and as it will undoubtedly be necessary for us to raise and equip and send to the theater of war additional forces to this 1,000,000 men as rapidly as we can do so, it is reasonable to suppose that if we can have ready within a year from now artillery for a second million men, that is quite within the resources of the country as far as men are concerned. Whether we can get them to the theater of war or not is another matter. Of course, we will make the greatest possible effort to get them to the

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