mates should be taken on Tuesday, a | had urged the House to take stringent day unusual for such a purpose, and measures against hon. Members from Ireupon which the Estimates could not be taken, without a suspension of the Standing Orders. He merely wished to call attention to what had happened during the last half-hour, which had been deliberately wasted by hon. Members opposite, because it tended to strengthen his impression that it was absolutely necessary that the House should frame for itself some Rules to prevent what he must consider a gross abuse of its Privileges.

MR. DILLWYN rose because, he said, he was desirous that they should conform to the ruling of the right hon. Gentleman in the Chair, and to the Rules of the House. His hon. Friend the Member for North Warwickshire (Mr. Newdegate) had referred to an attempt to violate the Rules of the House by taking the Estimates that day-Tuesday-instead of on Wednesday. He should like to know, whether there was any Rule to prevent Supply being taken on Tuesday; and whether it was out of Order to move the adjournment of the House on the Motion for going into Supply on Wednesday?

MR. NEWDEGATE said, his hon. Friend had misunderstood him. He did not say it was irregular to move the adjournment of the House; but that the manner in which the time of the House had been wasted for half-an-hour was an abuse.

MR. DILLWYN did not refer to the Motion for adjournment; but he understood the ruling was that Supply was to be taken by Standing Order only on Wednesday. He fancied he must have been mistaken with regard to that; and he wanted to know whether there was any Rule which would prevent the hon. Member for Meath, or anybody else, from moving an Amendment that Supply be taken on Tuesday, instead of Wednesday? He was quite aware that the Standing Order provided that Supply should be taken on Wednesday; but he was not aware that such Standing Order or Rule would prevent Supply being taken before Wednesday. He merely wished for information, because he was always desirous of obeying the ruling of the right hon. Gentleman in the Chair.

MAJOR NOLAN remarked, that that was the sixth time the hon. Member for North Warwickshire (Mr. Newdegate)

Mr. Newdegate

land, so that in this respect his conduct had been perfectly consistent. The object of the hon. Member was to incite the House to take strong measures; but he (Major Nolan) hoped the House would not be actuated by any such feeling of hostility towards any section of hon. Members. He could fancy that the conduct of the hon. Member would be quite consistent if he were sitting in the French Convention of 1793, where if a man was in a minority he ran a chance of getting his head cut off.

MR. O'SHAUGHNESSY said, the hon. Member for North Warwickshire (Mr. Newdegate) had made two points. The first was, that it was out of Order, and a breach of the Rules, to set up Supply for Tuesday night; and the next, that it was contrary to the traditions of the House, and an interference with the functions of the Government, to attempt to suggest anything with regard to dealing with the Estimates. He begged to protest most strongly against such a doctrine. Surely, if any hon. Member considered that any arrangement made by the Government for taking the Estimates concerning any particular branch of the public service was such as to preclude a proper discussion upon them, he had the Constitutional right to stand up and ask for some other arrangement to be made, in order that a full and proper discussion might take place. The hon. Member for North Warwickshire had made an indirect appeal to the House to take strong measures against the hon. Member for Meath, in order to repress what was, undoubtedly, their Constitutional right. He had to say, in answer to that suggestion, that any strong measures which were taken against the four or five Irish Members who had insisted upon opportunities for discussing these Estimates would bring to the front not five but 50 Irish Members who would insist on their rights.

MR. GRAY said, the hon. Member for North Warwickshire (Mr. Newdegate) had characterized an attempt to elicit from the Government an intimation as to when they would bring on certain Irish Estimates as an abuse, and had

endeavoured to incite the House to use

strong measures to repress the right which was now enjoyed of free speech in that House. It was a fair question,

whether the hon. Member was himself Motion made, and Question proposed, "That a sum, not exceeding £580,045, be granted for the Post Office Packet Service."

in Order in making such a suggestion, seeing that he was one of the Members of the Select Committee which was then sitting to consider whether any amendment in the Rules for regulating the MR. FRASER-MACKINTOSH said, mode of procedure in that House should that there was included in the Vote a be adopted or not. He (Mr. Gray) sum of £260 for conveying the mails should not follow the hon. Member's betwixt Dunvegan and Lochmaddy, and example, and attempt to prejudice the he regretted to state that the postal serHouse as to what changes in the Rules vice altogether in the Outer Hebrides they should adopt; but he thought that was most ineffective. The Postmaster if the House were in a position to con- General must be aware that the counsider this matter dispassionately, it would ties of Inverness and Ross, and the town be much more important to discuss the of Inverness, assembled in public meetconduct of the hon. Member for Northings, had passed resolutions condemnaWarwickshire in attempting to prejudice the House against certain hon. Members, he being a Member of the Select Committee now having the Business of the

House under their consideration.

tory of the service, and remonstrances from other quarters had often been made, as yet without effect. The passage was generally stormy, no sailing packet could make it regularly, and nothing short of a steam service to Lochmaddy would suffice. It was the case that let

MR. SPEAKER: I have to observe, with reference to the question raised by the hon. Member for Swansea (Mr. Dill-ters were sometimes received in Inverwyn), that the Committee of Supply can only be fixed by a Minister of the Crown; and that, according to the Standing Order, the Committee of Supply must be fixed for Monday, Wednesday, or Friday. I apprehend, however, that it might be open to any hon. Member to move, as an Amendment, that some other day should be substituted, when the Government has given Notice of their intention to take Supply on a particular day. The Question is, that this House do now adjourn.

Question put, and negatived.

Original Question put, and agreed to.
Committee deferred till Wednesday.

SUPPLY-REPORT.

Supply [6th June],-Further Proceeding on Report [7th June] resumed. (23.) "That a sum, not exceeding £580,045, be granted to Her Majesty, to complete the sum necessary to defray the Charge which will come in course of payment during the year ending on the 31st day of March 1879, for the Expense of the Post Office Packet Service."

(24.) "That a sum, not exceeding £743,372, be granted to Her Majesty, to complete the sum necessary to defray the Charge which will come in course of payment during the year ending on the 31st day of March 1879, for the Salaries and Working Expenses of the Post Office Telegraph Service."

Twenty-third Resolution read a cond time.

se

ness from America within a shorter period than from parts of the Long Island. There were two banks in the district, which was a populous one, and at certain periods of the year a large business connected with the fisheries was carried on. The answer hitherto given by the Post Office was, that the revenue being so small, no further accommodation could be given. This view of the Post Office, that it was a source of revenue, was only a modern one; and, while he should be glad to see a surplus, it ought to be after the requirements of the public were fully satisfied. The people in the district in question paid taxes like others of the Queen's subjects; and he thought their case, so remote, and in many respects hard, was one peculiarly calling for the consideration of Government.

Here he might rest, having stated the grievance, leaving it for the postal authorities to remedy it. But he would suggest that, as the Highland Railway

and its connections carried the Northern Scottish mails, and had lately contracted for the mails to the Orkney Isles, performing all the services to the satisfaction of the Post Office, the Postmaster General should put himself in communication with the Railway Company, so as to have steam service betwixt Strome Ferry and Lochmaddy. To put himself in Order, he would now move the reduction of the Vote by the sum of £260.

ing.

Amendment proposed, to leave out general discussion on the second read"£580,845," in order to insert "£579,085."-(Mr. Fraser-Mackintosh.) Question proposed, "That £580,045 stand part of the Resolution."

MR. BIGGAR also hoped the second reading would not be opposed, believing that in the case of a Bill of such magnitude and importance it would be impossible to discuss the details before they were in Committee. The Bill proposed to do away with a great many acknowledged abuses, and there should be no obstacle thrown in the way of

LORD JOHN MANNERS said, he
was not aware that the hon. Member
was going to bring forward this subject,
or he would have refreshed his memory
upon it. But he was quite aware of the
importance of the subject; and he ven-making progress with it.
tured to point out to the hon. Member
that if he omitted from the Vote the
small sum he proposed, there would be
no postal service at all with these
Islands a result that the hon. Member
would be the first to deprecate. He
would be glad to confer with him, and
see if some arrangement could be made
to meet his views.

Amendment, by leave, withdrawn.
Original Question put, and agreed to.
Subsequent Resolution agreed to.

CRIMINAL CODE (INDICTABLE OF-
FENCES) BILL.-[BILL 178.]
(Mr. Attorney General, Mr. Solicitor General,
Mr. Assheton Cross.)

SECOND READING.

Order for Second Reading read. MR. MORGAN LLOYD trusted his hon. and learned Friend the Attorney General would not persist in pressing forward the second reading of the Bill at that period of the night. Although he (Mr. Morgan Lloyd) was in favour of the measure, yet it contemplated making such great changes in the law, that he thought they ought not to give it a second reading without an opportunity of having its principle fully discussed.

MR. HERSCHELL hoped his hon. and learned Friend (Mr. Morgan Lloyd) would not oppose the second reading, by agreeing to which they would be committing themselves to nothing. They were all agreed as to the principle of the Bill, which was merely a consolidation and simplification of the law. The alterations proposed were so very important, and would lead to so much discussion, that he thought the several points could be better considered in Committee on the clauses than by a

THE ATTORNEY GENERAL (Sir JOHN HOLKER) said, he sincerely hoped that the Bill would be passed that Session, and he did not see why there should be any difficulty in the accomplishment of that object. As the hon. and learned Member for Durham (Mr. Herschell) had said, the main object of the Bill was to consolidate and simplify the law; and no doubt, in addition to that object, it proposed certain alterations and great amendments in the law, which would have to be discussed. It would not be reasonable to suppose that alterations of the importance of those introduced by the Government in this measure could be allowed to pass into law without full and adequate discussion; but there would be abundant opportunities of discussing those seriatim when the Bill came before the Committee. He, therefore, earnestly hoped that his hon. and learned Friend opposite (Mr. Morgan Lloyd) would not oppose the second reading of this Bill.

MR. MORGAN LLOYD asked the hon. and learned Attorney General whether, if he (Mr. Morgan Lloyd) consented to withdraw his opposition now, the hon. and learned Gentleman would give them an opportunity of discussing the Bill on going into Committee? It seemed to him that there was great inconvenience in having a measure of that sort go into Committee without an opportunity being afforded of discussing some of the important principles which it contained. If that opportunity was to be afforded, he should be perfectly prepared to withdraw his opposition at the present moment.

It

SIR JOSEPH M'KENNA hoped the hon. and learned Attorney General would not give any such assurance. was not at all convenient to the House that such an undertaking should be given in matters of this kind. It would be much better to take the sense of the

House on the second reading; because the almost universal opinion of the House was in favour of the principles of this Bill.

MR. SHAW LEFEVRE thought the proposal of his hon. and learned Friend the Member for Anglesea, that an opportunity should be afforded of discussing the Bill on going into Committee, was a very reasonable one; and he hoped the Government would put down the Bill as the first Order of the Day on going into Committee, so that an opportunity might be given to Members of expressing their opinions on the Code as a whole. Subject to this, he had no objection to now reading the Bill a second time.

for many years, that Morning Sittings should commence. [Sir CHARLES W. DILKE: But not on Fridays.] He believed that what he had just stated held good both in regard to Tuesdays and Fridays; and he had no doubt it would be for the general convenience of the great majority of the House that there should, for the remainder of the Session, be Morning Sittings on those days. Of course, he was aware that such Sittings entailed upon the Government a corresponding obligation to do the best they could in order to keep a House in the evenings; and that they were most anxious to do. He hoped hon. Members would feel that it was really for the general advantage that they should get on with Business as well and as rapidly as they could; and the Morning Sittings constituted a favourable opportunity for proceeding with Bills which were already in Committee.

MR. ASSHETON CROSS said, he had, in conjunction with his hon. and learned Friend the Attorney General, taken some trouble in this matter, and he hoped the advice of the hon. and learned Member for Durham (Mr. Herschell) would be followed. There could be no advantage in discussing the Bill on general principles; but if they were going to discuss it at all let them discuss it now, and not on going into Committee. Bill read a second time, and committed within his recollection, had it been for Thursday.

WEIGHTS AND MEASURES (re-committed)

BILL.-[BILL 143.]

MR. DILLWYN said, that to the best of his recollection, it was early in the Session to take two days a-week for Morning Sittings. They were now only in the middle of June, and a considerable time must yet elapse before their labours were brought to a close. Never,

proposed to take Morning Sittings on Tuesdays and Fridays at so early a period. But there was another consideration which ought not to be left out of sight in connection with such Sit

(Mr. Edward Stanhope, Sir Charles Adderley, tings; and that was, that they precluded

Mr. Attorney General.)

from attendance in the House, to a greater or less extent, of hon. Members who were engaged on Select Committees. That was an element which

did not appear to him to have been sufficiently considered in suggesting the proposed arrangement.

THE CHANCELLOR OF THE EXCHEQUER said, he would name Thursday for the Bill instead of Friday; and, meantime, he would look into the records of the House as to Morning Sittings.

SIR CHARLES W. DILKE said, he did not think that a Morning Sitting should be taken on Friday without more Notice than this. Surely the House ought to have some due, timely, and MR. BIGGAR observed, that the hon. formal intimation of the intention of the Member for Stafford (Mr. Macdonald) Government in regard to the matter. It had an important Motion on the Paper was an unusual thing to have Morning for Friday with reference to the miners Sittings on Fridays at the present period of the country, and he hoped an opof the year; and, under these circum-portunity would be afforded to the hon. stances, he must oppose the Motion. Gentleman of bringing that Motion forward.

THE CHANCELLOR OF THE EXCHEQUER hoped that the Motion would be agreed to. A period of the Session had now been reached when it had been usual,

Motion amended, and agreed to.
Committee deferred till Thursday.

MR. ONSLOW said, he did not know who had charge of the measure that evening; but if the Bill was to be put down evening after evening, and morning after morning, it was the duty of someone either to move that the Order for its Consideration should be discharged, or that it should be fixed for some day when hon. Members might know that it would be definitely disposed of. The Bill had been put down night after night before Easter, and night after night before the Whitsuntide holidays, and now it seemed likely that it would be put down night after night again. He moved, as an Amendment, that Consideration of the Bill be definitely fixed for Monday, July 1st.

MR. M. BROOKS said, that before the Question was put, it would be convenient if the House received some statement on the subject of the Bill. He hoped that if the right hon. Gentleman the Chief Secretary was unable to make a statement in the House, they would hear that the Report of the Commission, and the evidence relating to the subject, would be laid on the Table immediately.

MR. GRAY said, the matter was in a very anomalous condition. About a week ago he addressed a Question to the right hon. Gentleman the Chief Secretary for Ireland. He had asked the right hon. Gentleman when the Report would be placed on the Table, when it would be in the hands of hon. Members; and, whether a copy of it had been supplied to an individual Member before it had been supplied to Members generally? and the reply which he received from the Chief Secretary was to the effect that his own copy had been shown to one hon. Member of the House, and that the delay which had taken place in connection with the Report had been occasioned by the printers in Dublin. From MR. SPEAKER pointed out to the his (Mr. Gray's) knowledge of the printhon. Member that, according to the usual ing office in that city, he should be incourse followed in the House, the Mem-clined to think that the Chief Secretary ber in charge of a Bill named the time for its Consideration as amended. To move that the Order for that Consideration should be discharged, in the absence of an hon. Member in charge of a Bill, might cause the greatest inconvenience; and was a proceeding which was never taken without due Notice.

MR. ONSLOW said, he should be the last person in the House to do anything irregular; but he begged to give Notice, that when anyone who appeared to have charge of the Bill stated to the Clerk at the Table that he desired it to be considered on such and such a day, he would move that the Order be discharged. Consideration, as amended, deferred till Thursday.

had been under a mistake in thinking the delay arose from that cause. But if it was intended to delay the production of the Report for a long period, so far as he still thought that a copy of it might the House generally was concerned, be placed on the Table of the House, in order that Members might have an opportunity of perusing it.

IRELAND (Mr. GIBSON) said, the Report and the Evidence would be laid upon the Table in a few days. The Chief Secretary was, he believed, quite accurate, at he time he spoke, as to the cause of Minutes of the Evidence were not then the delay in printing the Report. The printed, and he himself had only read the Report which had been given to the Chief Secretary.

THE ATTORNEY GENERAL FOR

Question put, and agreed to.

tion of Rates in the city of Dublin; and to the Bill to amend the Law relating to the Collec office of the Collector General of Rates; and for other purposes, ordered to be brought in by Mr. JAMES LOWTHER and Mr. ATTORNEY GENERAL for IRELAND.

Bill presented, and read the first time. [Bill 220.]