BUREAU OF LIGHTHOUSES.

STATEMENT OF MR. GEORGE R. PUTNAM, COMMISSIONER.

Mr. CABLE. You will notice that we have put in again this year an estimate increasing the salary of the chief of the bureau from $5,000 to $6,000. We did that for the purpose of being consistent and because we think that the service is worth it.

SALARY OF COMMISSIONER.

Mr. JOHNSON. You have asked for the increase for the Commissioner of Labor, Commissioner of Lighthouses, and the others there. Mr. CABLE. In three of the other bureaus the proposed increase is from $4,000 to $5,000.

Mr. JOHNSON. You are the Commissioner of Lighthouses?
Mr. PUTNAM. Yes, sir.

Mr. JOHNSON. Didn't you ask us last year to abolish the office of deputy commissioner?

Mr. PUTNAM. Yes, sir.

Mr. JOHNSON. And we tried to get it through, but it went out on a point of order.

Mr. PUTNAM. That is right; but it was simply to substitute another position for that, and the other position was not given. We wanted the same number of positions.

Mr. JOHNSON. We tried to give you what you wanted, but we were defeated in our efforts by a point of order being made against it. Mr. PUTNAM. Yes, sir.

Mr. JOHNSON. Do you desire the change made now?

Mr. PUTNAM. It will be too late to effect what we had in mind then.

Mr. JOHNSON. You do not ask it here.

Mr. PUTNAM. The former deputy commissioner has resigned from the service and the former chief engineer has been appointed deputy commissioner, so the thing has been worked out in a different way from what we proposed at that time. So we do not ask for any change now.

Mr. JOHNSON. Now, Mr. Secretary, you wanted to say something in behalf of the commissioner which he would not feel at liberty to say for himself.

Mr. CABLE. It is just what I said last year. This is the largest bureau we have. Mr. Putnam has over 5,000 people on his permanent force. As I say, it is the largest bureau we have, and, of course, it is a very important one. Now, it seems to me that as long as any bureau chief gets $6,000 the chief of the Bureau of Lighthouses ought to get it. It seems to me the position is worth that much. Of course we think the individual now holding it is worth the salary we are asking here. Mr. JOHNSON. I notice a very marked discrepancy in the salaries paid the heads of these bureaus. Is there much difference in the responsibilities?

Mr. CABLE. No, sir; I do not believe there is now. Mr. Putnam was for many years in the Coast Survey, and was in charge of the chart division. He has put in about 15 or 20 years time in preparing himself for a place like this.

Mr. GILLETT. The question is whether the other bureaus are not getting too much-at least, that is one question.

Mr. CABLE. It is a pretty important matter to organize the work of a new bureau.

CLERICAL FORCE.

Mr. JOHNSON. Mr. Putnam, we gave you $64,630 for the current fiscal year, and you are asking for $200 less. That is due to the transfers made of clerical services, I presume?

Mr. PUTNAM. That provides for the transfer of one clerk to the Secretary's office.

Mr. JOHNSON. The present change is simply to transfer one clerk* to the Secretary's office. Did you find that you had too many men? Mr. PUTNAM. No, sir; it was on account of certain disbursing work which was done by the disbursing clerk of the department. That greatly increased the work of the department, and that clerk was transferred temporarily.

Mr. CABLE. The department at the time of the termination by law of services of Army and Navy officers in the Lighthouse Service directed the disbursing clerk to do the greater part of the disbursing work for the Lighthouse Service in order to determine whether under this plan the efficiency of the work could be increased and the cost of doing it reduced. After an experiment covering practically six months it is found that this method of doing the work is impracticable, owing to the great diversity of the purchases made by the Lighthouse Service, the isolated location of many of the employees and payees of vouchers. The department has approved a plan of appointing special disbursing agents at the various districts for the purpose of handling current disbursing work.

At the time the estimates of the department were prepared sufficient experience had not yet been gained to determine that the plan would not be practicable, and therefore the employee detailed from the Bureau of Lighthouses for certain work in the Secretary's office was included in the Secretary's estimates. When the work is again done in the Bureau of Lighthouses his services will be needed in 'the work there.

A communication is forwarded to the committee requesting that this change be made.

Mr. PUTNAM. I should call attention to the fact that there are provided here a number of changes in the force without affecting the total amount at all. The effect of these changes is to drop seven clerical positions, at various rates of pay from $720 to $1,200, and to add two technical draftsmen positions, at $1,200 and $1,500, and also three clerical positions one at $1,680 and two at $1,020. The reason for these changes is the fact that nearly all the work of the Bureau of Lighthouses is of a technical nature, and it is important to have employees capable of handling work of this character. It is difficult to carry on the work with the present force, because some of these clerks who are getting small salaries are not able to do that class of work. They are capable of doing certain classes of routine work, but a great part of the work, as stated, is technical. This change simply carries out in the bureau here the reorganization of the Lighthouse Service which has heretofore been carried out in

the field service in compliance with the act of Congress. These changes do not affect the total amount of the appropriation, but they will increase the efficiency of the bureau's office in Washington.

TUESDAY, NOVEMBER 26, 1912.

CENSUS OFFICE.

STATEMENT OF MR. E. DANA DURAND, DIRECTOR, AND MR. WILLIAM A. HATHAWAY, CHIEF CLERK.

Mr. JOHNSON. We gave you for this year $696,340, and you are asking us to give you $711,240 for next year. That means an increase in force and some promotions. Please state your reasons for asking this increase.

COTTON AND TOBACCO STATISTICS.

Mr. DURAND. The reason is merely to enable us to perform the additional work which was placed upon us by the legislation of last year with regard to the collection of statistics of cotton and tobacco. While this on the face of it is an increase, when you consider the two special appropriations which Congress made last year in the sundry civil bill for these two purposes, which amounted to $45,000, there is really no increase. We are simply putting into our regular appropriation the clerical cost of doing that work which for this present year is carried by a lump-sum appropriation in the sundry civil bill. Mr. BURLESON. In what bill?

Mr. DURAND. In the sundry civil bill. There is an appropriation in that bill of $45,000 for these investigations I have referred to. We figure that about 14 clerks, 7 at $1,200 and 7 at $1,400, are required for the office work covered by that new legislation.

Mr. JOHNSON. You are carrying on that work out of a lump-sum appropriation and you are now putting the same people who are doing the work under the lump-sum appropriation in this appropriation?

Mr. DURAND. Yes, sir.

Mr. JOHNSON. And you are proposing to pay them the same salaries here as are being paid them out of the lump-sum appropriation?

Mr. DURAND. Substantially. It was necessary to use special agents for that work this year. That lump-sum appropriation did not authorize specifically the employment of clerks, but we have a general authority under the law to employ an indefinite number of special agents.

Mr. JOHNSON. If we allow you the clerical force asked for this year, will there be any request for this lump-sum appropriation?

Mr. DURAND. No, sir; except there is also some work in the field which has to be done to carry out the new legislation regarding cotton and tobacco statistics, and we shall have to do that work out of the regular lump-sum appropriation of the bureau, which should therefore be slightly increased over last year. We have a lump-sum

appropriation for field work every year. In other words, Congress appropriated about $45,000 for doing that special work this year, and we are asking for about that same sum for next year, distributed between the item for clerical service and the lump-sum item for the collection of statistics.

Mr. BURLESON. How is the new Bureau of Foreign and Domestic Commerce getting along?

Mr. DURAND. I do not know very much about it, Mr. Burleson. I have been on a committee that had the investigation of a certain particular feature of that work. The committee has made some recommendations which I think will perhaps appear in the Secretary's annual report or in the message of the President. Aside from that, I know very little about their work. It is outside of my jurisdiction.

Mr. BURLESON. You were discussing this item here. You say that these clerks were provided for in the sundry civil bill?

Mr. DURAND. Yes, sir. If I might say by way of explanation, the theory of these estimates made this year is that, except during the decennial census period and during the time we are taking the quintennial census of manufactures and agriculture, I think the Census Office ought to keep its appropriations nearly uniform. I believe that, except for 1915 and 1916, we can get along until the next decennial census period with about the same appropriations as we are asking for now, which are just about the same as the average appropriations for several years preceding the decennial census. Our aim is to distribute the work as nearly as possible uniformly so as to keep the force from fluctuating up and down-to adapt the work to the force.

We can not quite do that, however, with regard to the cost of the collection of statistics in the field. When we take up some extensive special investigation, while we can do all or a great deal of the work by sending the clerks from the office into the field, there may be for that one year extraordinary expenditure for travel. We can get along with a uniform appropriation to cover the salaries of clerks, but travel expenditures can not be made so uniform. We have, therefore, one special item in this bill, and that is $100,000 for the expenses of travel and subsistence in the collection of statistics of public indebtedness, valuation, taxation, and expenditures. There will need to be special appropriations on account of such special work-not every year, but from time to time-to do extraordinary things in the way of field work. In order to keep the force uniform, it is the purpose to make all field investigations, ordinarily, with the office force we have. I do not expect for some time to come, if I am still the Director of the Census, to ask for any appreciable increase, at least in the total number of clerks. Of course, we may ask for a chance to promote some of the clerks we have.

Mr. JOHNSON. On pages 277 and 278 you ask for $354,000 for doing that field work, and you have for this purpose in the current year $387,000, including the appropriation in the sundry civil act; but we are taking up in the first paragraph of the bill a part of the expense that that $45,000 covers.

Mr. DURAND. Yes, sir; and there is a small reduction in the lumpsum appropriation-counting the $45,000 appropriated as part of it

for this year-even after deducting the part of that item that goes into the clerical roll.

RENT OF BUILDINGS.

Mr. JOHNSON. You have a building rented for a period of years, have you not?

Mr. DURAND. No, sir; we went by the year, but have paid a uniform rental for six or eight years.

Mr. JOHNSON. At the same price, $22,080?

Mr. DURAND. The actual rental is $21,000 flat, and we ask for a small sum which we can use to take care of storage. We are not now using any outside storage, but our building is badly crowded, and it may be that when we are doing some kind of work that takes up more floor space we will have to store some of our great mass of documents outside.

STATISTICS OF PUBLIC INDEBTEDNESS, ETC.

Mr. JOHNSON. On page 279 you are asking $100,000 for an entirely new purpose.

Mr. DURAND. This work on public indebtedness, etc., is required by law to be done once in 10 years, but it is not a part of the regular decennial census.

Mr. JOHNSON. And next year is the time that the law requires that statistical matter to be gathered?

Mr. DURAND. The time is not expressely fixed; that is, the exact year is not fixed by law. The act creating the permanent Census Bureau provides, in substance, that in the interval between the regular decennial censuses the Director of the Census shall decennially collect statistics on various subjects-among others, on this particular subject. We collected those statistics 10 years ago, during the years 1903 and 1904. The work was published in 1904, but most of the work was done in 1903.

Mr. JOHNSON. Will this appropriation complete that work or simply begin it?

Mr. DURAND. It will probably complete it, so far as the field work is concerned. That will be all that we expect to ask for.

Mr. JOHNSON. Is it very difficult to gather the data that are required by that act?

Mr. DURAND. Yes, sir. The law does not specify how it shall be done; but it is necessary for us, in making a report of real value on public indebtedness, valuation, taxation, and expenditures, to send an employee to every county seat in the United States, of which there are 3,000, and to every State capital and to all the cities of any considerable size-I think to all cities of over 8,000 inhabitants-and that means an immense number of different visits to be made. We do not intend to employ any temporary special agents or other outside people to do that work. In that work we propose to use our regular force, sending the men out from Washington. It might seem cheaper to employ local people, but when you consider that the work required is of a highly technical character, you will see that we could not give them the necessary training.

Mr. JOHNSON. Will you finish that work this year under that appropriation?

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