enterprising and stirring friend, who is at the head of the Geological Survey, will want a navy. We ought to have but one.

Mr. MONEY. Will the Senator allow me?

Mr. HALE. Yes.

Mr. MONEY. Has not the Treasury Department a navy in the Revenue-Cutter Service?

Mr. HALE. I think I mentioned that.

Mr. MONEY. I beg pardon. I did not hear the Senator.

Mr. TILLMAN. Mr. President

The PRESIDENT pro tempore. Does the Senator from Maine yield to the Senator from South Carolina?

Mr. HALE. I will yield to the Senator from South Carolina.

Mr. TILLMAN. I simply want to refer to one other navy, and that is the army transport service, which is assuming magnificent proportions, and about which I have heard some little scandal.

Mr. LODGE. That is being steadily abolished and reduced, I will say for the information of the Senator from South Carolina.

Mr. HALE. All these suggestions are precisely in the line of what I am trying to bring forward before the Senate. Here is an attempt-and in itself, if kept in proper limits, a wise attempt to bring different branches that are in some degree cognate in their duties under one head; but while we are about it we ought not to divide and put the various duties of these bureaus into a new Department where they naturally do not belong, and take them from another where they do belong.

The Navy Department at one time practically administered the duties of the Coast and Geodetic Survey, furnishing accomplished officers who led their parties and who conducted to a considerable degree their surveys and triangulations. It was then as efficient a service as it has ever been since, and a Senator on my right says a great deal more so. I am inclined to think he is correct about that.

I want to get my figures- I do not expect, of course, that the bill will pass to-day, because there is a great deal in it that we want to discuss-but after I get my figures, I think I shall move an amendment to transfer the Coast and Geodetic Survey to the Navy Department. The Senator in charge of the bill, who is, I think, reasonable in his conduct of it in every way, sees the force of the objection that that Survey should not be in this bill and is inclined to let it go out; but while we are launching upon the work of reassorting and rearranging bureaus we might as well do the whole business here. When the proper time comes I think I shall make the motion which I have indicated. I will not make it at present.

Mr. MONEY. Will the Senator from Maine permit me a moment?
Mr. HALE. Yes.

Mr. MONEY. I desire to suggest to the Senator from Massachusetts [Mr. Lodge] that he have his amendment printed and referred to the Committee on Foreign Relations, as it touches the State Department somewhat. I think that would be the proper course if it meet his approval. I do not want to make the motion, however. Mr. LODGE. The amendment now pending simply creates an officer at the head of a new bureau. It does not require to be entirely germane and it does not require any action by another committee.

Mr. MONEY. I have no desire to make a motion. I merely made the suggestion. I should like to see it in print.

Mr. LODGE. It will be printed to-morrow.

I think when the Senator looks at it

he will see that it is a very small matter. It is the creation of only one office.
Mr. MONEY. As I understood, the Senator proposed the immediate consideration
and adoption of the amendment.

Mr. LODGE. I simply moved the amendment. It is now pending.
Mr. MONEY. It is now pending. It may be very largely concluded-

Mr. LODGE. There is no objection to it on the part of the committee having the bill in charge.

Mr. MONEY. That may be, but there may be objection outside of the committee, and I should be glad to see it in print. If there is no intention of concluding the bill to-day, and I guess we will hardly do that, I should be very glad if no vote shall be taken until it can be examined into a little.

Mr. HALE. I think the suggestion of the Senator from Mississippi is a good one. I am free to say

Mr. LODGE. Let it go over and be printed. I will not move it now.

Mr. MONEY. I think that is right.

Mr. HALE. I think the Senator from Massachusetts has it about right, that we will probably adopt it, but I think it wise not unduly to seek dispatch in a matter of this great importance. There is time enough in the Senate to consider it. Other matters

are not pressing, and while I shall not stand in the way of the passage of the bill in any undue fashion, yet I want to get some figures as to the Coast and Geodetic Survey. The PRESIDENT pro tempore. The Chair understands that the amendment of the Senator from Massachusetts is now withdrawn, and he asks that it lie on the table and be printed.

Mr. HALE. That it be printed.

Mr. LODGE. That is my request.

The PRESIDENT pro tempore. Without objection, it will be so ordered.

Mr. TELLER. I desire to move to strike out section 6. I understand the committee having the matter in charge have agreed that it shall go out.

Mr. LODGE. I did not hear the Senator from Colorado. What section does he propose to strike out?

Mr. TELLER. To strike out section 6, which proposes to transfer the Geological Survey from the Interior Department to the new Department. I understand the committee agree that it may be done.

Mr. NELSON. There is no objection to that.

The PRESIDENT pro tempore. The question is on agreeing to the motion of the Senator from Colorado to strike out the whole of section 6.

The motion was agreed to.

Mr. BACON. I desire to ask the Senator from Massachusetts whether the direction given his amendment includes all the amendments offered by him?

Mr. LODGE. Oh, no; the others were adopted.

Mr. BACON. It simply covers the last one?

Mr. LODGE. The last one.

Mr. BACON. Which is complete in itself?

Mr. LODGE. Which is complete in itself, being a new section.

Mr. BACON. Very well.

Mr. HALE. Has section 6 gone out bodily?

The PRESIDENT pro tempore. It has gone out.

Mr. HALE. The entire section?

The PRESIDENT pro tempore. The entire section.

Mr. HALE. That is right. The confusion was such that I could not understand. Mr. NELSON. I desire to offer an amendment.

Mr. HALE. If the Senator in charge of the bill wishes to offer an amendment, I will yield.

Mr. NELSON. I offer a further amendment. On page 3, lines 3 and 4, I move to strike out the words "and the United States Coast and Geodetic Survey."

Mr. HALE. I move to insert after the words proposed to be stricken out the words, "and the same is hereby transferred to the Navy Department."

Now, Mr. President, I do not expect

Mr. PLATT of Connecticut. The Senator from Maine does not want a vote on his amendment to-day?

Mr. HALE. NO. The Senator from Connecticut says he hopes I will not ask for a vote on the amendment to-day. I do not expect that the Senate will vote on it to-day. I want them to have a little time to consider. It is proper, I think, that it should go there, but I would not precipitate a vote on my amendment now. Then I want also, as other Senators do, to discuss the Census Bureau and several other subjects. Therefore I shall not insist upon a vote to-day, and unless there are other amendments

Mr. PLATT of Connecticut. Will the Senator from Maine permit me?
Mr. HALE. Certainly.

Mr. PLATT of Connecticut. Mr. President, I hope there will be no attempt to secure to-day a vote either upon the bill or any of the important amendments which have been suggested. I desire to say that as I look at it to-day I do not see any reason why one of the most valuable bureaus in the United States Government should be forcibly removed from the present Department to which it is attached and transferred to this new Department. I refer to the office of the Commissioner of Patents, which has had pretty hard and severe treatment hitherto, Mr. President.

The Patent Office building was built for that office, and at some subsequent time it was attached to the Interior Department. The Interior Department proceeded to utilize, occupy, and crowd the Patent Office until the disposition of the people of the United States and its Congress, in providing that building for the Patent Office and the recognition of the Patent Office in thus providing therefor, seems to have been entirely set aside.

I shall have quite a little to say on this bill before it passes. Thus forcibly, and without any reason that I can think of, to take the Patent Office away from the Interior Department, with which it has become correlated and adjusted, so that its

business proceeds by rules and regulations, it seems to me would be a very strange proceeding. I do not want to go into it to-day. I can say considerable on this subject, and before the bill comes to a conclusion I should like to be heard on that proposition.

Mr. HALE. I think there is a general feeling that these great subject-matters ought to be investigated, and we can not do it today. I therefore move that the Senate proceed to the consideration of executive business.

Mr. FAIRBANKS. There are a few uncontested bills on the Calendar

Mr. HALE. If the Senators desire to go to the Calendar by unanimous consent, I will withhold the motion for the present.

Mr. LODGE. I hope the Senator from Maine will do that. There are a great many uncontested and unobjected bills on the Calendar. It is early in the day.

Mr. NELSON. I ask that the pending bill may go over, retaining its place on the Calendar.

The PRESIDENT pro tempore. The Senator from Minnesota asks that the pending bill may go over, retaining its place on the Calendar.

Mr. COCKRELL. All right.

The PRESIDENT pro tempore. If there is no objection, it is so ordered.

Mr. PETTUS. I suggest that the bill be printed with the amendments to it.

Mr. COCKRELL. Let it be printed as it is now amended.

Mr. PETTUS. And with the amendments offered.

The PRESIDENT pro tempore. Is there objection to the request of the Senator from Alabama? The Chair hears none, and it is so ordered.

Mr. NELSON subsequently said: I request that the bill proposing to establish a Department of Commerce be reprinted with the amendments which have been adopted to-day.

Mr. COCKRELL. That has already been ordered.

The PRESIDING OFFICER (Mr. Gallinger in the chair). The Chair is informed that that has already been done.

Mr. NELSON. I think not; but if it has already been done, well and good. I ask to have it reprinted with all the amendments that have been adopted, and also one amendment proposed and not adopted.

The PRESIDING OFFICER. The Chair is informed that the bill has been ordered reprinted with the amendments, and that the amendment to which the Senator from Minnesota refers is included.

January 20, 1902, the debate was continued in the Senate.

Mr. NELSON. I ask unanimous consent that the Senate resume the consideration of the bill (S. 569) to establish the Department of Commerce.

There being no objection, the Senate, as in Committee of the Whole, resumed the consideration of the bill.

Mr. NELSON. Mr. President, I desire this morning briefly to correct some misapprehensions which seem to exist in reference to this bill.

When the bill was first called up for consideration I did not apprehend that there would be any serious objection to it from any direction, but from remarks which have been made by some Senators while the bill has been up I have been led to believe that there are some parts of the measure which are not fully understood.

We find, on looking over the Executive Departments of the Government, that the only industrial interests of the country which are under the administration, guidance, direction, and protection, if I may use that phrase, of an executive department are our great agricultural interests. They have for years had the Department of Agriculture, which has looked after the agricultural interests of the country in a very practical, useful, and comprehensive manner.

I have no doubt it is the consensus of opinion in this country that that Department has performed a most useful and necessary function for our agricultural interests. Now, if we look abroad in other directions, through the industrial fields; if we look at our commerce, foreign and inland; if we look at our great manufacturing industries, our shipping industries, and our fishing industries, and all through the great industries of the country, we find that those several industries and interests have no governmental department to which they can look for guidance, advice, and administrative care.

In every other country of any consequence, with but few exceptions, even among the smaller countries, there is a department similar to that proposed in this bill. Every country has felt the need and the necessity for such an administrative depart

ment to look after its commercial and industrial interests. One of the latest countries to act on this principle is Russia. Until two years ago the administration of the commercial, manufacturing, and industrial interests of Russia was a part of the finance department of that country, which is the same as the Department of the Treasury in this country.

In addition to this there has been a greater demand throughout the industrial and commercial world for the establishment of such a department and for this legislation than there has been for any other bill I can recall which has been pending before Congress. The Committee on Commerce have been overwhelmed with resolutions, petitions, and memorials from commercial bodies, manufacturing bodies, shipping interests, and other industrial interests all over this broad land-East, West, North, and South. I have had some little experience in legislation, although not so much as many other Senators here, and yet I can say that in my experience I know of no bill which has had such hearty support and such great interest taken in it throughout the country as has this great bill.

Now, this bill aims-and that is its purpose-to establish an executive department the duty of which shall be to foster, promote, and develop commercial, manufacturing, fishery, shipping, and all other great industries of this country. We find on looking through the several departments of this Government that there are some bureaus, divisions, and branches of the service scattered around in a heterogeneous manner that are in part devoted to some of the work involved in this bill, but they are scattered around in such a manner that they can not work in unison or in harmony or to a common purpose and end.

It is intended by this bill to equip the proposed Department with all those bureaus and branches of the public service that relate to these subjects-that relate to the commercial interests of the country; that relate to the manufacturing interests of the country; that relate to the shipping interests of the country; that relate to the labor and immigration interests of the country, and that relate to the fishing industry of the country.

Now, it has been said that the effect of this bill will be to withdraw a great many bureaus from other departments and to overload the proposed Department and to make it the great Department of Government. Mr. President, that is founded on a misapprehension and a misunderstanding of the case. The two great departments of the Government which to-day are overcrowded and have more work than they ought to do, and work of a disconnected and inharmonious character, are the Treasury Department and the Interior Department. A year ago, when I carefully looked up the subject by making inquiries at the Department, the Treasury Department had a force of 4,881 employees, while the Interior Department had 4,440 employees. When I speak of employees I mean the employees who are working in the several bureaus in Washington. The other departments have but a minor force— the Department of Justice only 141, the Navy Department 324, the State Department 95, the Post-Office Department 697, the Agricultural Department 804, the War Department 1,787-while each of the other departments, the Treasury and the Interior Department, has a larger force than all the other departments combined.

Now, look at the character of those departments. Take, for instance, the Treasury Department. The chief scope and purpose of that Department is to take charge of the fiscal and financial operations of the Government; to collect the revenue from customs and internal revenue; to disburse that revenue for all public purposes; to take charge of our currency, of the coinage, of our national debt, and of all that pertains to the fiscal and financial operations of the Government. As its name implies, it is the Treasury Department, or what they call in other governments the finance department, of the Government.

Now, in the course of time that Department has been lumbered up with a lot of matters foreign to its main purpose. The Department of the Treasury has attached to it the Life-Saving Service, the Light-House Board, the Marine-Hospital Service, the Steamboat-Inspection Service, the Bureau of Navigation, the United States Shipping Commissioners, the Bureau of Immigration, the Bureau of Statistics, and the United States Coast and Geodetic Survey.

Now, all these branches of the public service, the titles of which I have read, have no relevancy to or bearing upon the financial or fiscal administration of the Government. They have charge of matters each and all of which peculiarly appertain to commerce and navigation, to the industrial interests of this country, and they ought not to be attached to a department charged with the fiscal affairs of the Government. Mr. HALE. Mr. President

The PRESIDING OFFICER (Mr. Fairbanks in the chair). Does the Senator from Minnesota yield to the Senator from Maine?

Mr. NELSON. Certainly.

Mr. HALE. I perceive the force of the suggestion which the Senator from Minnesota is making. It has struck me in reading over the list of these different bureaus in the Treasury Department

Mr. NELSON. If the Senator will allow me, I could, before he asks the question, give him a little supplemental information which would make his question more germane, I think.

Mr. HALE. I was merely going to ask why all these branches should be taken out and put in a new department-the Light-House Service, the Steamboat-Inspection Service, the Shipping Commissioners, etc.-while the Revenue-Cutter Service was left with the Treasury Department?

Mr. NELSON. My answer to that is this, and the Senator can see the force of it: The Revenue-Marine Service aids in the collection of our revenue on water. It partains to the fiscal management of the Government. It is the duty of that service to look after smuggling by water. We have along our international boundary a lot of Treasury agents looking after smuggling by land, and the Revenue-Cutter Service is that branch of the service which looks after those matters on water, if I may use that expression. That is why. It appertains peculiarly to the collection of our revenue, and has to protect and preserve it from smuggling and other things. Hence we find that revenue cutters in all our ports and harbors frequently run out to sea and meet vessels coming into port, and revenue officers are immediately put on board the great Atlantic liners.

I think the Senator will agree with me, in view of the fact that this service has peculiar charge of the branch of the service which relates to the collection of the customs revenues, that it should belong to the department of the Government charged with that duty.

Mr. HALE. I agree with the Senator. I supposed that would be the answer given. But I think it applies also to some of the other services.

Mr. NELSON. I will take them up more in detail later.

Mr. HALE. But the Senator is going on, and I will wait until he is at leisure. Mr. NELSON. Now, from a remark made by the honorable Senator from Maine the other day, I inferred that he thought there was very little left for the Treasury Department. I will call his attention, if he has the report of the committee, to page 4, where he will find the fact stated that, taking these bureaus and divisions out of the Treasury Department, as the bill proposes, the Treasury Department will still be left with the following bureaus and divisions of the public service; and if the Senator will listen he will see what a multitude they are:

Treasurer of the United States, Director of the Mint, Comptroller of the Currency, Bureau of Engraving and Printing, Division of Public Moneys, Division of Loans and Currency, Secret Service Division, Comptroller of the Treasury, Register of the Treasury, Auditor for the Treasury Department, Auditor for the War Department, Auditor for the Interior Department, Auditor for the Navy Department, Auditor for the State and other Departments, Auditor for the Post-Office Department, national-bank redemption agencies, Commissioner of Internal Revenue, Commissioner of Customs, and the Revenue-Cutter Service.

All those bureaus will remain the Treasury Department, and it will have a great and immense force.

Now let me call the Senator's attention to the character of the divisions of the service which it is proposed to transfer to the new Department from the Treasury Department. We transfer, first of all, the Bureau of Navigation, because it relates to the shipping industries of the country. In connection with it we transfer the Life-Saving Service and the Light-House Board. Now, a mere inspection-and it needs no argument, for everyone can see at a glance-shows that the Life-Saving Service and the Light-House Board all pertain to our shipping interests. They relate to matters of navigation. They have no bearing on or relevancy to any of the chief duties vested in the Treasury Department. They have no bearing upon the financial or fiscal operations of the Government. They bear directly upon our shipping industries and indirectly upon our commercial interests so far as they are connected with our shipping industry.

The same is true of the Light-House Service and the Marine-Hospital Service. The latter service is charged with looking after the welfare of our sailors connected with our merchant marine. Why should that service remain with the Treasury Department? Why should not that be attached to the Department of Commerce and Industries?

Take the Steamboat-Inspection Service, engaged in inspecting our steamboats and seeing that they are safe-that they are properly licensed to navigate our waters. Why should the Treasury Department be charged with that duty, and is not that a duty which peculiarly pertains to the province of commerce and to our shipping industries? The same is true of the United States shipping commissioners, who have