Tuesday]

JOHNSON-WILSON-SOLOMON.

[February 24th

Mr. JOHNSTON. I desire to make a sugges-two-thirds of the Board, the Governor may tion, which I think will extricate us from the di- order a special session. lemma in which we now seem to be placed, in regard to these two reports.

The principal objection to the majority report seems to arise from the fact that it goes more into detail than the other. The principles in both reports, I believe, are the same. The report of the majority provides for a board of education; so, also, does the report of the minority. But the majority report goes on into detail, and states the duties and powers of that board of education, while the report of the minority leaves to the legislature to settle everything that relates to this board of education.

Sec. 6. The Board of Education shall organize by appointing from their body a presiding officer, and the appointment of a Secretary and other inferior officers usual in Legislative Assemblies. They shall keep and publish a journal of their proceedings, which shall be distributed in the same manner as the journals of the General Assembly.

Sec. 7. All rules and regulations made by said Board, shall be published and distributed to the several Counties, Townships, and such School Districts as may be provided for by said Board, and when so passed, published and dis

The details of the majority report are contributed, they shall have the force and effect of

And

tained in the first eleven sect.ons of it.
for the purpose of bringing up this question in
a way which will meet the views of all parties,
I will move to strike out of the majority report
from the first to the eleventh section, inclusive,
and insert in lieu thereof, the first section of the
minority report. That, I believe, will bring the
whole subject before the committee. If the gen-
tleman from Jefferson [Mr. Wilson] will with.
draw his motion to substitute the minority for
the majority report, I will submit the motion I

have indicated.

Mr. WILSON. I have no objection to do that, as the motion of the gentleman from Lee [Mr. Johnston] being of the nature of an amendment, takes precedence at any rate of a motion to substitute for the whole report.

Mr. JOHNSTON. The first eleven sections of the majority report, which I move to strike out, reads as follows:

Section 1. The Educational interests of the

law.

Sec. 8. Said Board shall have full power and authority to legislate and make all needful rules and regulations in relation to Common Schools and other institutions of learning that are instituted to receive aid from the School or University funds of the State.

Sec. 9. Said Board may appoint a Chancel

lor, who shall have jurisdiction over all questions that may arise under the laws, rules and regulations of the Board, and from all decisions and judgments of said Chancellor, an appeal may be taken to the Supreme Court.

Sec. 10. The Board of Education shall provide a system of Common Schools, by which a School shall be organized and kept in each Districts failing to organize and keep up a School, trict at least three months in each year. may be deprived of their portion of the School Fund.

Dis

Sec. 11. The Board of Education shall estab

State, to include Common Schools and other Ed-lish one University, which shall be located at ucational Institutions, shall be under the management and control of a Board of Education,

which shall consist of sixteen members.

Sec. 2. No person shall be eligible as a member of said Board who shall not have attained

the age of twenty-five years, and been two years

a citizen of the State.

Sec. 3. The General Assembly shall district the State into sixteen Educational Districts, and one member of said Educational Board shall be chosen by the qualified electors of each district, and shall hold their offices for the term of four years, and after the first election under this constitution, the Board shall be divided by lot into two equal classes, and the seats of the first class shall be vacated after the expiration of two years, and one-half of the Board shall be chosen every two years thereafter.

Sec. 4. The first session of the Board of Education shall be held at the seat of government, after which, said Board may fix the time and place of meeting.

Sec. 5. The session of said Board shall be limited to twenty days, and but one session shall be held in one year, except upon extraordinary occasions, when, upon the recommendation of

until such time as such location may be made, some central point in the State, Provided, that and suitable buildings erected, said University shall continue as at present located.

the following, being the first section of the miI move to insert in lieu of the above sections, nority report:

"The General Assembly shall provide for the election or appointment of a Board of Education, to be composed of twelve persons, who shall be the Trustees of the University, and shall have the general charge and control of education in the State. They shall have power to appoint a Secretary of the Board, who shall be their exclusive agent, and perform such duties as may be imposed upon him by the Board of Education or the laws of the State."

I do this in order that I may be able to hear both propositions thoroughly discussed, without at the same time, deciding which of the reports I am in favor of.

Mr. SOLOMON. Before the question is taken upon this motion of the gentleman from Lee, [Mr. Johnston,] I would like, for information, to have read that portion of the Secretary's

SOLOMON-JOHNSTON-HALL.

minutes which relate to our going into commit-referred to the committee of the whole for their tee of the whole.

to this department, to this board of education, you must make them something more than mere ministerial officers, something more than mere drudges to carry out the will of the legislature. You must give them duties to perform, You must endeavor to obtain those who have experience in this matter, and engage them to give efficiency to the cause of education. This is the position which I take.

Now let us examine the two propositions as regards the appointment or selection of the board of education. If you adopt the one proposed by the majority, then you have the State divided into educational districts, the people of each district electing their representative to this board. You thus establish the relation of representative and constituency between the officer and the people interested in the cause of education. You thereby give character to the officer by the manner of his appointment, and the position in which he is placed. The very dignity with which you clothe the office gives character and force to the acts of the officer, when he is called upon to discharge his duties. I claim that it is important that this relation of representative and constituency should be maintained between the officer who is to represent this great interest, and the people who are to be affected by his acts. So in that respect the majority report has the advantage.

[February 24th

ity of the constitution; a department that the legislature cannot change every year; a department not subject to the caprice of hasty legislation as we frequently find it in the halls of our Senate and House of Representatives. It will have permanency; it will have character: it may be presumed that it will have wisdom, three things which our system of common schools must combine, before they can rise high in the scale of confidence and respect.

Under this minority report, this board will be but the mere plaything and tool of the legisla ture, to be put in office to-day, and to be turned out to-morrow; to be directed to do this thing next week or next month. This board, under now, and another and entirely different thing this minority report, must look to the legislature for their power, and everything that pertains to their duties.

clogged in their movements by bad rules and regulations, established by means of hasty legislation.

But if you give them position, influence and character, as this majority report proposes to do, the result will be that they will be men, who will be able to think and act for themselves; they will be men who will have capacity, and whose whole duty will be to look to the cause They will learn of education and that alone. its wants and provide for satisfying them. They will meet twice as often as the legislature, holding their sessions annually. They can and will look to this important and growing interest, and In the next place, by this majority report you will provide the means to cure any defects there give permanency to this officer, by fixing the may be, and to urge on the growth of that imtime for which each member of the board of ed-portant interest, without being interrupted or ucation is to serve. You give character to them by giving them authority, when the board is assembled to use the wisdom which experience and observation have given them, and which the suggestions from the various districts may prove necessary. And you give efficiency to the cause by enabling this board, when the suggestions from the various districts are laid before them, to act at once upon them. That is a reason why we should fix the term for which each member elective, and then fix the time at the end of which they shall return to the people. As to the length of their terms of office, whether two, four, or six years, that is a very small matter. All I desire is to establish the principle, in order to give constitutional character and weight to this body when they have once convened.

of this board is to serve. First make the office

Some gentlemen may speak of the expense. But I say this is the cheapest mode of preparing proper rules and regulations to control this imone hundred and fifty members in the general portant subject of legislation. There are to be assembly, with all the paraphranalia of a legislative body, while in this board of education you will have but sixteen members. One day ing with this subject of common schools, will spent by the legislature tampering and tinkercost the State more than a whole session of the board of education. If this board perform their duties as they ought, they will relieve the legislature of much if not all that they have now to do in relation to the subject of education. In the next place the majority goes on to pro- The discussions and deliberations of the board vide the manner in which this board shall con- of education upon this subject will be worth a duct itself. It virtually gives it the form and thousand times more than the discussions of the position of a legislative body; that is, they must legislature, where a hundred other matters are discuss the subject of education and go through struggling for their attention, and this is hurried forms of procedure like a legislative body. Their through without consideration or reflection, and aessions are limited, and they have jurisdiction voted upon by men who never devoted their time over nothing but matters pertaining to the cause to the consideration of the subject. By this maof education in this State. They cannot appro- jority report you separate this subject, you dipriate any of the school or university fund; vorce it, from all this variety of topics, subjects they cannot interfere with the financial system claiming the attention of the legislature. You connected with the common schools of this State. take it from the legislature, to which men are This board of education is made by this ma-elected upon other and different grounds from jority report, one of the departments of the gov- those which should be taken into consideration ernment of this State, established by the author- here, and whose minds are absorbed in the con

Tuesday]

sideration of other topics. This report keeps the subject of education by itself, and places it in the hands of those elected solely in reference to that subject, who have nothing to do with anything but this one great subject.

This is the principle for which I contend. As I observed in a very broken and ill-arranged manner the other day, this plan of the majority will call out men who have the cause of education at heart, who are devoting, as they have heretofore devoted, their lives to this great work. This will be the effect of it. There is enough of talent and ability in this state; there is enough of learning and devotion to the cause of education, if you will only allow it to operate unfettered and untrammeled, to elevate our state above every other state in the Union. But to do this, the whole matter must be turned over to them, and they must have full scope to do what they may see to be necessary.

Two years ago I attended a meeting here called to take into consideration the subject of education, and although it was in the middle of the winter, and the weather was very severe, and unpleasant, yet we had assembled here in the halls of the capitol one of the largest and most respectable conventions that was ever gathered together in the State. Gentlemen of the highest ability and learning were present as delegates from all parts of the State, and had come here as volunteers in the great cause to which they were so much attached; and they manifested a zeal and enthusiasm in this cause, which I regret the legislature has not seconded by their action upon this subject.

the benefit of their judgment and experience in this cause.

The leading feature of this majority report is to divorce and separate the cause of education from the wild and hurried scramble of the political arena, and consign it untrammelled and unfettered to the care of those who are best qualified by experience and education to promote its interests and mature it into a healthful growth. The legislation of the last winter upon this subject is enough to convince any man that this matter ought to be confided to a class of men such as I have designated.

What has been done by the legislature during the last ten years to advance the cause of education? The deplorable condition of our common school system has been acknowledged by all, and we are all agreed in the belief of its utter inefficiency to accomplish the objects for which it was designed. Its organization, the mode and manner of transacting its business, the management of its finances, are such as to reduce the systèm almost to a state of decay. Two years ago, the legislature, acknowledging their inability to perform the work of revising our school system, authorized the Governor to appoint a board to revise the laws relating thereto. The Governor, acting upon the authority given him by the legislature, appointed a citizen of our own State, and two eminent citizens of other States, who had devoted their lives to this subject, as members of this board of revision.

I have no doubt that Governor Grimes, although he has been abused for making these apThe discussions which took place at this con- pointments, acted from wise and disinterested vention displayed a great deal of research and motives, and that he believed that if we could information upon the part of those who took obtain the experience of these men who had depart in them. And I was never more entertain-voted their lives to the cause of education, they ed in my life by the proceedings of any body, than I was by those of this convention.

The

would be enabled to devise a system which
would prove satisfactory to the people.
board met, and, after a great deal of care and
deliberation, drew up a report upon this subject
which was presented to the legislature; but it
met with no favor or consideration at the hands
of that body. This is the condition of things at
the present time.

But the zeal and enthusiasm which they manifested upon this subject has not been met in the like manner by our legislature. We now propose to turn over this cause to a body that will be composed of men who have devoted their talents and energy, in a great measure, to the promotion of the education of the masses; in It must be acknowledged by all that the genorder that we may derive the benefit of their eral assembly is not the fit body to manage and learning and experience in instituting a system have jurisdiction of the system of education. of education that shall be an honor to this great Go where you will throughout the state, you State, and a blessing to the community at large. will find that it is universally admitted and conI know, and other gentlemen here must know, ceded that the legislature are unable to supply that in a great majority of instances, persons the wants and provide for the necessities of our who gave devoted their time to this subject, school system. Shall we, then, as the represenmen of education and reading, who wish to de- tatives of the people, adjourn and leave the most vote themselves to the cause of education, are noble cause that can engage our attention in the modest men, who cannot push themselves for- imperfect and unsettled condition in which it ward in the political arena, and who prefer to has existed for ten years past? I say, No! and work in a more quiet and unobtrusive field, I hope gentlemen will reflect seriously upon so where they can accomplish more good by the ex-important a matter as this, and not, through ercise of their talents. Our legislature, from being too much occupied with other matters, have scarcely listened to men such as these, when they have pressed the claims of education upon their attention; and we have hitherto lost

prejudice, refuse to take a step in advance, that will have the effect, as I think, of giving character and efficiency to a system calculated to promote the growth and progress of common school education in this state.

The leading principle in the report offered for your adoption, is this: to give character and stability to our common school system, by turning it over to men who are teachers and thinkers, and who have spent their lives in literary pursuits. We have men enough in this State who are abundantly qualified to fill the places which may be assigned them in this board of education. If gentlemen find that the details of the system, as reported by the majority, are insufficient or injudicious, they can be easily corrected. And I ask them to propose such corrections as may be necessary; and if they can suggest a better way of carrying out the details of the system, I am ready to accept their suggestions; but I entreat them to preserve the grand principle embodied here.

I do not desire to elaborate an extended argument upon this question; I will therefore proceed to consider another part of the subject, claiming the privilege of answering objections that may be made to this report.

[February 24th

pointment of a chancellor. Gentlemen may cry out at the expense which the appointment of such an officer will entail upon the State. I believe there are a hundred men in this State eminently qualified to take this office and discharge its duties, who would do it without receiving a dollar's salary; men who are engaged in, and devoted to, the cause of education; men who look to the interests of the rising generation, and seek to elevate them by promoting the cause of education among the masses, are not men generally who love money. There have been more sacrifices made by men of that character and of high tone of feeling, than is generally supposed. I do not believe the appointment of such an officer as the chancellor would add a dollar to the expense of the system.

generally.

By the establishment of this board you create a tribunal to which all questions that arise in the different school districts may be referred, and from which there would be an appeal to the supreme court, which is made by the constituFrom the action of this Convention, I under- tion the court of last resort. There can be no stand that the office of Superintendent of Public collision between this board and the legislature, Instruction will not be retained any longer in as some gentlemen apprehend, for they do not this State, and, therefore, some other plan must depend absolutely upon one another. They will be devised for the supervision of all matters re- each work harmoniously in their proper spheres. lating to education. If the Convention shall What we want is to give to this board characagree to establish this board of education, the ter and efficiency, so that they can provide for question then comes up, how shall this board be the wants and necessities which have been so established? How shall it be constituted so as long felt by the people of this State, as connectto give strength and efficiency to the school sys-ed with the interests of schools and of education tem? That is the question which this Convention is called upon to decide. I do not wish to take up the time of the Convention unnecessarily with this matter, but I feel a great deal of interest upon this subject. Therefore I hope I will be excused if I should consume any considerable time in enlarging upon this matter. It is a question in which I took a deep interest in 1844, as the journals of the Convention then held will fully testify. I was, at that time, a member of the committee that had charge of this subject. I endeavored then to get a provis-pared to give, intelligibly, to this body, my own ion passed which would give efficiency to our system of common school education; but the State was then poor and had no funds, and the man would have been considered insane who would then have claimed that our school fund, by this time, would have amounted to four millions of dollars. I recollect making an estimate at that time, and I could not, by any calculation, demonstrate that it would be more than two or three millions at the utmost.

I have reflected much upon this subject, and I have endeavored to get the views of other gentlemen, who have had more experience upon this subject than I have. So far as Ihave ascertained, I find a general concurrence upon the part of these gentlemen in favor of the proposition to give independence, stability and efficiency to the board of education, however it may be created.

Three things are essentially necessary, in my opinion, to the successful operation of the system; and, first, the report provides for the ap

Mr. ELLS. The discussions in which we have been engaged for the last twenty-four hours, Mr. Chairman, I apprehend have disqualified the most of us from taking a calm and deliberate view of this question of education. I am truly sorry that the majority of the convention have felt it their duty to force this discussion upon us at this time, for I believe the cause will be injured rather than profited. For myself, sir, I can truly say, that I am not pre

views and reflections. The majority, however,
having decided the question of procedure, I
must submit. When I yielded the floor the
other day, for a motion to postpone the discus-
sion, I was just entering upon the discussion
of the comparative merits of the two reports.
I will now resume my remarks, and very briefly
state my objections to the plan proposed by the
mejority. But first, permit me to say, sir, that
it was my good or bad fortune to differ with the
majority of the standing committee.
(And
whether good or bad, time will determine.) The
result of that difference is embodied in the mi-
nority report of the committee on education.

It is generally more agreeable to agree than to disagree with gentlemen in the discussion of any question; but where such agreement would compromise any great good, or violate any fundamental principle, I hold that duty demands an honest and manly avowal of such disagree

ment.

The motion of the gentleman from Lee, [Mr.