tives who were present. We have consistently adhered to that position. The minutes are maintained by experienced reporters who attend these meetings and who are part of a paid, full-time staff. The CHAIRMAN. Do the minutes in the form of a summary really reflect what happens at the meetings? Mr. ROPER. I think they reflect what happens at the meetings, Mr. Chairman, accurately and completely. They are not verbatim minutes in the sense that this reporter is making a record of this proceeding. It just wouldn't be feasible with the volume of work we have, and the personnel we have, to do that sort of thing. Also we try to issue these minutes very shortly after the meeting is held. If we had to clear the minutes with 20 or 25 industry members who might be scattered all over the country, it obviously would be an impossible task. The CHAIRMAN. Are there many more questions? We want to conclude. Mr. MALETZ. We have received a number of inquiries, and I think I asked you this question this morning, we received a number of inquiries as to whether the minutes of your industry advisory meetings are available to the press. I think your answer was, yes. Is that your understanding? Mr. ROPER. Minutes of IAC and industry conference meetings, if they do not contain classified material, are generally available upon request to the press and to other people. Mr. HONEYWELL. May I add to that we attempt to get out a press release instantly. I say "instantly," the same day for the current press, which is the reason why the press is not too much interested in many cases with this summary minutes of the whole meeting. They have had their news, and it is finished. Mr. MALETZ. In addition to that, are verbatim transcripts made of your industry advisory meetings and of your industry conferences? Mr. ROPER. No, sir. Mr. MALETZ. Verbatim transcripts are not made? Mr. HARKINS. And the reason for not making verbatim transcripts is because you are afraid there will not be full discussion? Mr. ROPER. That is one of the reasons, Mr. Harkins. Many years ago it was determined that the maintenance of verbatim minutes would be a deterrent to full and free discussion. That determination was made early in the days of NPA, and BDSA adheres to the procedure that was adopted and followed in NPA. The CHAIRMAN. Mr. McGrail, did you want to make a statement? Mr. McGRAIL. Yes. Mr. Honeywell, I mentioned the names of five WOC's earlier. I want to say there is no reflection on those WOC's at all. As a matter of fact, the staff received complete cooperation from their companies, and I am sure that the WOC's served very effectively and competently. Mr. HONEYWELL. Thank you for putting that into the record, because each one of those named individuals, with one exception, I am personally acquainted with and they are men of very high integrity, and contributed substantially to our work down there. Mr. McGRAIL. I am sure that is especially true of Mr. Firshing. Mr. HONEYWELL. He is a very able individual, and highly qualified in that field of the power division, and we could only command his interest, support and cooperation by making such an arrangement as this. Mr. HARKINS. One final question, on the advisory groups. Trade association executives are permitted to serve on industry conferences, but they are not permitted to serve on industry advisory committees or industry task forces, are they? Mr. HONEYWELL. I beg your pardon, that is not a correct statement. Mr. HARKINS. What is the correct statement? Mr. HONEYWELL. There is a letter which has been made public, which I am sure this committee has a copy of, from Secretary Weeks, to the American Trade Association executive organization, which states that at any meeting held in the Department of Commerce, a trade association executive is eligible if he has knowledge of the subject and if it is appropriate for him to attend. Mr. HARKINS. Is he eligible to become a member of an industry advisory committee. Mr. HONEYWELL. He is eligible to be a member of an industry advisory committee under those stipulations. No man may be a member of an industry advisory committee without invitation, and the criteria have been expanded to make it possible, where trade association executives have special knowledge, that they may participate in an IAC. (The following letter relates to the preparation of agenda for the Forest Products Industry and its conference appearing in pt. I, p.246.) Mr. C. T. GRAY, DEPARTMENT OF COMMERCE, BUSINESS AND DEFENSE SERVICES ADMINISTRATION, President, Stockton Box Co., Inc., Stockton 1, Calif. DEAR MR. GRAY: Your letter of January 26 regarding the agenda for the February 18 meeting with Secretary Weeks was forwarded to me by Mr. Bodine. We certainly do appreciate having your comments. The points you raise as inclusions for the agenda are certainly well taken. It was our thought, as you have suggested, that most of these would come under the topic "Industry, USFS-BLM Relations." This subject title has remained the same, although there have been some changes in the subtopics. Probably the individual items will be more general than would be indicated by your letter, but there will be opportunity for discussion of these elements. Your point 3, Government operation of sawmills and box factories, is something that the Forest Products Division is already working on. The Business and Defense Services Administration has already received the assurance of the Defense Department of sitting down with us and looking this matter over carefully so that they can get out of facets of business without hampering their activities. There is a valid reason in some instances, but no attempt has been made to justify their participation in the lumbering business. We will be looking forward to meeting with you on the 18th. Very truly yours, BERNARD L. ORELL, Director, Forest Products Division. The CHAIRMAN. That will terminate the hearings for the day. The document referred to during Mr. Honeywell's testimony is as follows:) [For immediate release, Thursday, February 10, 1955] UNITED STATES DEPARTMENT OF COMMERCE Washington 25, D. C. Sinclair Weeks, Secretary OFFICE OF THE SECRETARY Secretary of Commerce Sinclair Weeks today praised trade associations for their cooperation in 40 industry conferences held by the Department in the last 2 years and affirmed "the full and equal eligibility of both company and trade association executives" in all Department government-industry meetings. The Secretary's statement of policy is contained in a letter to Robert H. Shields, chairman of the Government relations committee, American Trade Association Executives, and president and general counsel, United States Beet Sugar Association. The text of the Secretary's letter follows: Mr. ROBERT H. SHIELDS, President and General Counsel, United States Beet Sugar Association American Trade Association Executive), Washington, D. C. DEAR MR. SHIELDS: Under Secretary Walter Williams has informed me of his correspondence with you concerning the participatiton of trade-association executives in industry advisory committees. As you well know, we have been trying to develop policies and procedures which would enable the Department to obtain the views and recommendations of American business to the end that we may constantly increase the effectiveness of our services to business, to the public, to the various agencies of Government and to Congress. The Department of Commerce places a high value on its close ties with trade associations, and I am glad to report to you that trade-association executives have made a splendid contribution to the forty-odd industry conferences which have been held. I wish to affirm the full and equal eligibility of both company and association executives. At all industry meetings within this Department where attendance is by invitation, both industry executives and trade association executives will be eligible for participation, when they have knowledge of the subject and their attendance is appropriate. Authority to extend invitations is delegated to the heads of primary agencies who initiate such meetings. I sincerely hope that all members of the American Trade Association Executives will recognize that the above statement of policy demonstrates our sincerity and appreciation of the great importance of representative trade associations in the work of the Department of Commerce. Sincerely yours, SINCLAIR WEEKS, Secretary of Commerce. (The following information concerning representation of trade association officials on advisory groups has been submitted to the subcommittee:) Hon. WALTER WILLIAMS, UNITED STATES BEET SUGAR ASSOCIATION, Under Secretary of Commerce, Department of Commerce, Washington, D. C. DEAR WALTER: After the election is over and you get a breather, let's have lunch and discuss ways and means of bringing our problem to a conclusion. I'll have my secretary call yours. In the meantime, I enclose a copy of my report which I hope fairly states the situation. Sincerely, BOB S. Mr. CHESTER C. KELSEY, WASHINGTON, November 2, 1954. President, American Trade Association Executives, Statler Hotel, Los Angeles, Calif. DEAR MR. PRESIDENT: During the past year the Committee on Government Relations has been concerned principally with trying to establish throughout the Government the eligibility of trade association executives to serve on, or sit with, Government advisory groups when it is the desire of the industries which they represent that they do so. In our discussions distinctions between advisory groups concerned with price and other specific control procedures and those concerned with Government-business relations under normal conditions have been recognized. During the past year the committee has had discussions with representatives of several Government agencies, including the Departments of Justice, Defense, Interior, Labor, and Commerce. Since the Department of Commerce was established to represent the views of industry in the Federal Government, the committee naturally turned to Secretary Weeks for leadership in the solution of its problem. It was also prompted to do this by the Secretary's action on June 12, 1953, in removing from the Transportation Council of the Department of Commerce the trade-association executives who had for years served on that advisory body. Accordingly, the committee in cooperation with representatives of the Chamber of Commerce of the United States and the National Association of Manufacturers as well as the help of ATAE's committee on relations with the Department of Commercemade arrangements for a representative group headed by ATAE President Kelsey, NAM Vice President Brennan, and C. of C. Trade Association Manager Mortenson, to discuss the problem personally with Secretary Weeks and his associates on December 15, 1953. The trade association position taken at that meeting was outlined in some detail in a joint communication dated December 11, 1953, copy of which is attached, which was sent to Secretary Weeks in advance of the conference. At the December 1953 conference Secretary Weeks was most cordial and indicated that it would be the attitude of his Department to work with and use the facilities of trade associations and their executives in every possible way. It was also stated that Commerce would issue within a few days thereafter a policy statement outlining the attitude of the Department with respect to trade association-Government relationships. It was also indicated that Commerce might take the lead in developing an administration policy statement on this subject. After 9 months, without Commerce issuing any policy statement, the committee on September 16, 1954, again brought the problem to the Department's attention in a letter of that date, copy of which is attached. At the same time the committee asked Judkins of Commerce for a list of all the advisory groups which met in Commerce during the first three quarters of 1954-showing the number of trade association executives participating. Yesterday, November 1, the committee received a report from Judkins and a letter from Deputy Assistant Secretary Oechsle in response to the committee's communications of September 16. In Judkins' report, copy of which is attached, he confirmed information given to the committee some weeks earlier that 31 BDSA conferences this year-29 chiefly of manufacturers and 2 of distributors-included 148 association and 613 company executives. He also points out that about three-fourths of the 106 associations represented at the 31 conferences were at the first 8 meetings listed. Unfortunately, Judkins does not list any meetings held except BDSA conferences. He states he has been unable to obtain lists of advisory groups where associations were not admitted-advisory committee, council, and task force meetings of which many have been held. The committee regrets, as we know the responsible officials in Commerce also regret, that-in Oechsle's own words- "it has been impossible for us [Commerce] to reexamine our position and communicate to your association the results of such review prior to this [ATAE Annual] meeting." The committee appreciates the difficulty and delicacy of the problem with which Commerce is concerned and is pleased to set forth in this report the full text of the Department's recent explanation of its need for further time, as follows: Mr. ROBERT H. SHIELDS, NOVEMBER 1, 1954 President and General Counsel, United States Beet Sugar Association, Washington, D. C. DEAR MR. SHIELDS: In connection with your discussions and correspondence with Under Secretary Walter Williams concerning inclusion of trade associa tion representatives in various groups working with the Department of Conrmerce, we enclose a copy of a letter on this subject sent today to Mr. Howard A. Prentice, newly elected president of the American Trade Association Executives. Under Secretary Williams has talked over with us your letter to him of September 16, 1954. It is our hope that the reexamination of this program mentioned in the enclosed letter will resolve the questions you called to Mr. Williams' attention. Sincerely yours, CARL F. OECHSLE, Deputy Assistant Secretary for Domestic Affairs. Mr. HOWARD A. PRENTICE, Washington, D. C. DEAR MR. PRENTICE: Thank you for giving us an hour of your time the other day, thereby permitting us to explain to you many of the ramifications which give us concern in relation to announcing any revision of policy on trade association executives participating in certain types of meetings held within the Business and Defense Services Administration. It is most unfortunate that the timing of your meeting on November 6 in Los Angeles catches us at a time when most of the top executives of the Department of Commerce are away from Washington on various missions. As a result. it has been impossible for us to reexamine our position and communicate to your association the results of such review prior to this meeting. The Business and Defense Services Administration of the Department of Commerce is appreciative of the assistance given it by trade association executives. We are anxious to include them along with industry executives in all meetings where their presence would be appropriate. Please assure your board that this whole subject will be given very careful review in the near future, and you may expect a statement of position by this agency based on such reexamination. As explained to you recently, BDSA has had 30 industry conferences, which served as an opportunity for exchanging information and views, from the middle of November 1953 through June 30, 1954. At these meetings there were some 613 private company representatives and 148 representatives from trade associations. I think you will agree that under this procedure there has been a substantial representation of trade associations-approximately 18 percent of the total attendance at such conferences. May I extend my congratulations to you in the presidency of the American Trade Association Executives which we understand you are about to assume. I enjoyed meeting with you and will look forward to further contacts. Sincerely yours, CARL F. OECHSLE, Deputy Assistant Secretary for Domestic Affairs. The committee's report should also make reference to Secretary of Labor Mitchell's communication dated September 16, 1954, expressing his views about trade associations and their executives. This letter was written in response to the committee's suggestion that the Secretary clarify the meaning of his remarks a few days earlier before the National Press Club. Although copies of Secretary Mitchell's letter of September 16 have already been circulated to ATAE members, a copy of this communication is attached for your convenience. Before concluding this report, the chairman of the committee wishes to thank its members for their help and assistance and also on behalf of the full committee to express special appreciation to president Kelsey for the effective leadership which he has given the committee in its efforts to improve trade associaion-Government relations during the past year. Respectfully submitted. WILLIAM DALTON, GEORGE P. LAMB, LOWELL D. RYAN, W. F. WILLIAMSON, ROBERT H. SHIELDS, Chairman, Committee on Government Relations.. |