lation to bring about the overthrow of our Government by force and violence. Father PARKER. I was interested in the case of a policeman who was accused of doing wrong, and I felt he should be energetically defended. He was, as a matter of fact, and didn't need anything particularly from me. It is true that a man does not have a constitutional right to demand and have a job as a policeman or any other Government job, or any other job, I guess. He has a right to live. But he certainly has a right, while he is on the force, to have his reputation protected. He has a right when he leaves the force not to leave it under a cloud of suspicion. It ought to be cleared up. Mr. WOOD. By some method adopted by the American people? Mr. WOOD. I can't leave unchallenged the statement you made using as an illustration that this legislation is somewhat akin to throwing the child out with the bath. Don't you agree, from a careful study of the proposed legislation, it rather is designed to prevent having to burn down the barn to get rid of the rats? Father PARKER. I think it is burning down the barn to get rid of rats we are not sure are there. Mr. WOOD. If we wait until the Government is overthrown, haven't we done that? Father PARKER. I don't think the American people will let this Government be overthrown. I don't think we need have any uneasiness about that. Mr. WOOD. Thank you, Father, for coming here. I enjoyed very much your discourse. The committee will stand at recess until 10:30 tomorrow morning. Thereupon, at 12: 10 p. m. on Wednesday, March 29, 1950, a recess was taken until Thursday, March 30, 1950, at 10:30 a. m.) HEARINGSTON LEGISLATION TO OUTLAW CERTAIN UN-AMERICAN AND SUBVERSIVE ACTIVITIES THURSDAY, MARCH 30, 1950 UNITED STATES HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES, PUBLIC HEARING Washington, D. C. The committee met, pursuant to adjournment, at 10:30 a. m., in room 226, Old House Office Building, Washington, D. C., Hon. Francis E. Walter presiding. Committee members present: Representatives Francis E. Walter, John McSweeney (arriving as indicated), Morgan M. Moulder, Harold H. Velde, and Bernard W. Kearney. Staff members present, Frank S. Tavenner, Jr., counsel; Louis J. Russell, senior investigator; Charles McKillips and William Jackson Jones, investigators; John W. Carrington, clerk; and A. S. Poore, editor. Mr. WALTER. The meeting will come to order. Mr. Straight, will you raise your right hand, please. You swear the testimony you will give in the matter now in hearing will be the truth, the whole truth, and nothing but the truth, so help you God? Mr. STRAIGHT. I do. Would you like to swear Mr. Nikoloric also? He will be with me. Mr. WALTER. Do you swear the testimony you are about to give in the matter now in hearing will be the truth, the whole truth, and nothing but the truth, so help you God? Mr. NIKOLORIC. I do. TESTIMONY OF MICHAEL STRAIGHT AND LEONARD A. NIKOLORIC Mr. WALTER. State your names, please, for the record. Mr. STRAIGHT. My name is Michael Straight. I am the national chairman of the American Veterans Committee. Mr. NIKOLORIC. My name is Leonard A. Nikoloric. I am a lawyer with the firm of Arnold, Fortas & Porter in Washington. I have advised the American Veterans Committee with respect to this bill. Mr. TAVENNER. Mr. Straight, will you state your official position with your organization? Mr. STRAIGHT. I am the national chairman of the American Veterans Committee. Mr. TAVENNER. It is the practice and custom of this committee and committees of the Senate to ask each witness appearing on subversive questions whether or not he is now or has ever been a member of the Communist Party, so I would like to ask you that question. Mr. STRAIGHT. I am not and have never been a member of the Communist Party. Mr. TAVENNER. Do you have a prepared statement? Mr. STRAIGHT. We have a prepared brief which I understand you would like to have submitted for the record rather than read out loud. I would like to make a few spontaneous remarks regarding our feelings on this matter, which are not legal. The brief contains our legal interpretation of the bill. Mr. TAVENNER. That is satisfactory. Mr. STRAIGHT. Mr. Nikoloric has prepared this brief, and in the brief we explain why we feel the bill before you is unconstitutional. We feel that any effort along the lines of this bill to legislate in matters of opinion is probably unconstitutional. We feel in this particular case if the bill were enacted by the Congress and were upheld by the Supreme Court, then, because the bill attempts to legislate by fiat, and because it attempts to punish people for association and opinion without the safeguards of common law, it would open up not only the Communist Party but other organizations in this country to a threat of prosecution for holding adverse opinions to the normal trend of the time. The Veterans of Foreign Wars, as a principal proponent of this bill, has declared, as has the Marine Corps League, that the world-government movement is treasonable. Mr. KEARNEY. Let me interrupt you on that point you have brought out here. Have they declared the world-government movement treasonable? Mr. STRAIGHT. The chairman of the Marine Corps League has, and I believe the Veterans of Foreign Wars has too. Mr. KEARNEY. I will take issue with you on that. I don't think they have. I have been strongly criticized for being one of the sponsors of the world-government bill, but I am a past commander of the Veterans of Foreign Wars, and no spokesman for that organization, to my knowledge, has ever declared the world-government movement a treasonable movement. Mr. STRAIGHT. I could show you some briefs that I believe indicate that position. In a speech in Boston the chairman of the Marine Corps League has declared the world-government movement to be treasonable. Mr. KEARNEY. That is not the Veterans of Foreign Wars. Mr. STRAIGHT. No, it is not. Advocates of world government are placed in jeopardy if this bill were considered constitutional. If there were no legal objections to this bill, we would still think the political objections to this bill were overriding. We share much of the opinion of many witnesses who have appeared before this committee that the Communist Party is a party directed from abroad by a foreign power. We believe it does advocate the overthrow of the Government by force and violence. We believe in many cases the Communist Party is used as a reception center and a training ground for espionage agents on behalf of a foreign power. However, we don't believe that the Communist Party today is a clear and present danger. We do not believe it can be isolated, and that it can be found to be concentrated in a very few front organizations such as this bill supposes. On the contrary, we believe the Communist Party can be found to be working in a very broad field of political organizations, perhaps in some of the organizations that have testified against this bill. We believe that since the Communist Party makes a practice of deception, makes a practice of attempting to confuse Communist Party members with non-Communist Party members, it is very hard to dif ferentiate between non-Communists and Communists. We recognize the Communist Party will be affected by legislation passed by the Congress, but we think nonetheless the advances and retreats made by the Communist Party in American life are made at the fighting fronts of organizations in which the Communist Party is attempting to carry its policy. Mr. Kearney, you know in your home town of Schenectady a fight has been waging for a long time between Communist leaders and the electrical workers, and from a superficial knowledge of that fight I can't believe it will be resolved by what is done in Washington. I think it will be resolved by what is done in Schenectady. Mr. KEARNEY. By the union. Mr. STRAIGHT. That is right. Mr. Chairman, we always come down to specific cases in matters of this kind, and in asking whether this bill will help or hinder those of us who are opposed to the Communist Party, I would like to mention the experience of our own organization, the American Veterans Committee, in this matter. I think most of the veterans' organizations at some time have been infiltrated by members of the Communist Party. The Communist Party, after the war, laid down as a policy of its Veterans Affairs Director that the Communist Party should infiltrate the American Legion. The American Veterans Committees was formed in 1945, and between 1945 and 1947 the Communist Party continually attacked the American Veterans Committee in the Daily Worker. After the American Veterans Committee made considerable progress and carried on a fight for emergency veterans' housing and other issues in which the Communists apparently felt we were making a strong appeal to the householder and veteran and worker, they reversed their line and attempted to infiltrate our organization. As far as we know they assigned some of their top veteran leaders to capture our organization. That fight went on for 4 years. The non-Communists, such as Mr. Nikoloric and myself, counterorganized. We had for a time two caucuses working with considerable secrecy. We were forced to adopt some of the Communist tactics to combat them. In the course of that fight the non-Communists demonstrated their ability to out-think and out-work the Communist minority. Mr. WALTER. Wasn't that due entirely to the fact you were able to spot the Communists? Mr. STRAIGHT. No. That is a very important point. We could not today name a single Communist in our organization who was active. We had John Gates who belonged and paid dues, but he was not active. He came to our meetings and directed his caucuses from hotel rooms. Today we would be unable to tell you who was a Communist in our organization and who was a Communist sympathizer, which is precisely why we have come here today to explain our views. In a series of steps, in which we were required to take more and more aggressive action to clear our good name, we finally drove the |