Maj. DRAKE. Yes, sir.

The CHAIRMAN. How is that price?

Maj. DRAKE. That price is a little high for a good many of them, but the bidders on the trucks put in a proviso that the price of their trucks would increase with the price of the material. Their books are to be examined by the accountants of the Quartermaster's Department.

The CHAIRMAN. Does the Government arrange to provide for the steel?

Maj. DRAKE. No, sir. That matter was taken up with the munitions board. On account of the character of the material which enters into truck building, the steel is always specially treated, and there are so many subordinate concerns who supply the smaller portions, that they considered it impracticable to take up the matter of supplying the steel for the motor trucks. That matter was taken with the munitions board of the Council of National Defense. The CHAIRMAN. Is a uniform price paid for all trucks except the Locomobile truck?

up

Maj. DRAKE. No, sir. We advertised for trucks on June 10. They fixed the price within certain limits.

The CHAIRMAN. You advertised for a certain number of trucks and a number of concerns submitted bids for parts of the order? Maj. DRAKE. Yes, sir.

The CHAIRMAN. Did anyone submit a bid for the entire order? Maj. DRAKE. No, sir; no concern is capable of doing that.

The CHAIRMAN. The orders were allotted to the various bidders? Maj. DRAKE. They were restricted to very few firms on account of the spare parts. Only six firms were given any large award of trucks.

The CHAIRMAN. Was there any complaint made from the other manufacturers?

Maj. DRAKE. Yes, sir; but they see the principle that determined it. The CHAIRMAN. How were the six concerns selected to whom the orders were given?

Maj. DRAKE. They were selected with these two ideas in view: First, the serviceability of their truck for our use, and, second, the production capacity of the particular factory and rate of their delivery.

The CHAIRMAN. With the adoption of a standardized truck, will that make it possible for any manufacturer to manufacture a truck? Maj. DRAKE. Yes, sir: that will probably allow 50 or more different truck builders to build our type of truck.

The CHAIRMAN. Do you recall the firms that were selected?

Maj. DRAKE. The Nash Motor Co., which manufactures the Jeffrey Quad Truck.

The CHAIRMAN. Is that a double-action truck?

Maj. DRAKE. No, sir: it moves forward.

The CHAIRMAN. There was a double-action truck?

Maj. DRAKE. That steered on all four wheels and made a very short turn.

The CHAIRMAN. That is not the truck?

4400-17-31

Maj. DRAKE. No, sir; the Clintonville four-wheeled truck, the Packard Motor Co., the Locomobile Co., the Pierce-Arrow Co., and the Garford Co.

Mr. SHERLEY. Did not the White people submit bids?

Maj. DRAKE. Yes; they submitted bids, but their rate of delivery was so slow between now and December 31 that we could not consider their bids.

Mr. SHERLEY. Do they not furnish any trucks?

Maj. DRAKE. They have furnished us with a number in the past, and we buy from them for local use now, but they could only deliver 425 trucks between September and January because of the foreign orders they have.

Mr. SHERLEY. They are manufacturing for the allies, are they? Maj. DRAKE. Yes, sir.

Mr. SHERLEY. Has there been any increase in the price over the price at which it was estimated these trucks could be purchased? Maj. DRAKE. Yes; there has been a material increase from $200 to $400.

Mr. SHERLEY. I have not followed it at all, but I notice the advertisements of the automobile people in the papers and magazines, and apparently a great many of them are offering to furnish the same sort of cars at the same price at which they have been furnishing them over some period of time.

Maj. DRAKE. Yes, sir; but just now they are about to advance their prices.

Mr. SHERLEY. Uncle Sam got in a little earlier on the advanced prices?

Maj. DRAKE. Yes, sir; the Cadillac people are raising their price $400 the retail price approximately $400.

Mr. SHERLEY. Were these prices arrived at by bids?

Maj. DRAKE. By bidding; yes, sir.

Mr. SHERLEY. Is there any difference in the prices submitted?

Maj. DRAKE. Oh, yes; a material difference.

Mr. SHERLEY. Did the lowest bidders get the contracts?

Maj. DRAKE. No, sir; they did not.

Mr. SHERLEY. Why not?

Maj. DRAKE. Because they have not trucks that are suitable for our service, and it would be a waste of money to buy them.

Mr. SHERLEY. Did you not ask bids on specifications?

Maj. DRAKE. Yes, sir.

Mr. SHERLEY. Then they did not bid?

Maj. DRAKE. Quite a number bid on them, but production could not be commenced for at least six months on trucks according to our specifications, and then the deliveries were to be so slow that we had. to take standardized trucks in order to get deliveries beginning in September.

Mr. SHERLEY. Who determined the companies that should get these contracts?

Maj. DRAKE. The Quartermaster General determines that. worked with the munitions board and the Council of National Defense also.

Mr. SHERLEY. Was it with the munitions board or was it an automobile committee?

Maj. DRAKE. An automobile committee; yes, sir.

Mr. SHERLEY. Those gentlemen were representatives of automobile companies, where they not?

Maj. DRAKE. One of them had been. Mr. Howard Coffin is chairman of the committee; Mr. Clarkson is an automobile engineer, but he has no interest in any automobile company at this time; he is a member of the committee, as well as Mr. Zimmersheid, who was formerly connected with the General Motors Co.

Mr. SHERLEY. What officers of the Government worked with them? Maj. DRAKE. Capt. Britton, of our office; Col. Birch; and myself. Mr. SHERLEY. There were six of you, then?

Maj. DRAKE. Yes, sir. Mr. Coffin never attended any of the meetings, however.

Mr. SHERLEY. You considered these bids, the time of delivery, the prices, and then made the allotments?

Maj. DRAKE. Yes, sir.

Mr. SHERLEY. Do you expect to be able to get all of these machines within the time you desire them?

Maj. DRAKE. We can get them all by June 30.

Mr. SHERLEY. How fast are you going to get them?

Maj. DRAKE. Beginning in September, when the deliveries begin, we can get approximately 1,500 or 1,800 a month.

Mr. SHERLEY. That is the number of trucks you will get per month?

Maj. DRAKE. Yes, sir.

Mr. SHERLEY. I suppose you can get immediate deliveries of these automobiles?

Maj. DRAKE. We can get immediate deliveries on them; yes. We make no formal awards, but just buy them as they are necessary.

Mr. SHERLEY. Under the head of operation and maintenance you have an item of 50,000 motor trucks, at $2,000 per truck, $100,000,000. That is not operation and maintenance, is it, but just a reserve supply?

Maj. DRAKE. That covers the operation of the trucks, the furnishing of gasoline, oil, and lubricants; also the furnishing of all spare parts.

Mr. SHERLEY. That does not mean you are going to buy that additional number of motor trucks, but it means just the maintenance and operation of them?

Maj. DRAKE. Yes, sir.

Mr. SHERLEY. You say that includes spare parts?

Maj. DRAKE. Yes, sir; extra bodies, and such things as that.

Mr. SHERLEY. You certainly are not going to need that $100,000,000 for some time?

Maj. DRAKE. I do not think we will need that all before June 30. Mr. SHERLEY. It will be six months before you get one-half of your trucks, will it not?

Maj. DRAKE. Yes, sir.

Mr. SHERLEY. Then you have, for operation and maintenance of 5,740 motor cars, at $1,200 per car, $6,888,000. That is for the same items?

Maj. DRAKE. Yes, sir.

Mr. SHERLEY. Then 7.500 motorcycles, at $200 per motorcycle, $1,500,000. That is for maintenance?

Maj. DRAKE. Yes, sir.

Mr. SHERLEY. Is gasoline the chief item in all of those maintenance charges?

Maj. DRAKE. Spare parts are the big items but, of course, gasoline is another large factor.

Mr. SHERLEY. A motorcycle does not cost much over $200, so that the spare parts should not be a big item.

Maj. DRAKE. Well, there will be a large stock required to ship abroad. We estimate one-tenth the value of a machine.

Mr. SHERLEY. One-tenth the value of a motorcycle would be only $35, so that $165 represents the other items?

Maj. DRAKE. That represents the repairs to it during the time it is in the service, gasoline, and lubricants.

Mr. SHERLEY. Has any arrangement been made touching gasoline, or does that come under you?

Maj. DRAKE. That comes under the supply branch, but I know they have made arrangements for procuring gasoline abroad direct from the oil companies.

Mr SHERLEY. These maintenance items will not really come into being, except in the supplying of spare parts, until your trucks get abroad, at least in most instances?

Maj. DRAKE. The largest portion of that will not be required, but, of course, some will be required. For instance, motorcycles will be required by September 1 by reason of the various divisions going into camp.

Mr. SHERLEY. Are these trucks going to be driven by enlisted men?

Maj. DRAKE. Yes, sir; they will be driven by enlisted men.

Mr. SHERLEY. You have been hiring outside men as truck drivers, have you not?

Maj. DRAKE. Yes; but we plan to have all of our trucks and motor cars, except in and around the depots and cities, furnished with chauffeurs from the Quartermaster Corps.

Capt. DALY. The $350 that you speak of as representing the cost of a motorcycle includes the side car, which would take about $80 off. Mr. SHERLEY. They are going to use them with a side car, so as to carry two men?

Maj. DRAKE. Yes; they intend to use a large proportion of side

cars.

HARBOR-BOAT SERVICE.

Mr. SHERLEY. Your next item is for the purchase and repair of boats necessary for the harbor-boat service of the Army for the transportation of troops and supplies, and for official, military, and garrison purposes, etc. How much has been allotted for that purpose?

Capt. DALY. I have not that figure here, Mr. Sherley.
Mr. SHERLEY. Will you supply it?

Capt. DALY. Yes, sir.

Mr. SHERLEY. You are asking now an additional sum of $1,927,500. Capt. DALY. That is for the purchase of three freight steamers, at $150,000 each; four steam lighters, at $100,000 each; three water and freight supply ships, at $200,000 each; running supplies, repairs, fuel, water, and incidental expenses of operation for one year, $477,500. They are boats required at the ports of embarkation.

Mr. SHERLEY. If the Navy is going to handle that, why do you need it?

Capt. DALY. Even if they handle the transports directly we would still have to supply this and do the harbor tending of the ships. Mr. SHERLEY. What have you now in the way of vessels for this purpose?

Capt. DALY. They are chartering ships.

Mr. SHERLEY. Do you propose to build these ships?

Capt. DALY. We propose building them or buying them.
Mr. SHERLEY. Where are you going to get them?

Capt. DALY. That I can not answer.

Mr. SHERLEY. How do you know what you can buy them for? Have you ever had this up with the Shipping Board?

Capt. DALY. I do not know about that, but I think not.

Mr. SHERLEY. Who determined the type and number of these vessels?

Capt. DALY. The general superintendent of the transport service in New York City furnished the data for this estimate, and he claimed that he could get those ships in New York Harbor. I think the main purpose was not to build but to purchase the ships.

Mr. SHERLEY. You know the provision carried in the last deficiency bill in relation to the shipbuilding program expressly contemplated and authorized the use of the Shipping Board for the purchase of ships and the supplying of ships for the Army and Navy, and authorized the reimbursement of their funds out of funds made available for the Army or the Navy; hence my inquiry as to whether this matter had ever been taken up with that board.

Capt. DALY. I think not, sir.

Gen. SHARPE. I do not think that matter has been taken up with the Shipping Board. We have taken up some other questions of ships with them-the purchase of other vessels-but I think not these particular vessels.

Mr. SHERLEY. How soon are you going to need these vessels?
Capt. DALY. We need them right now.

Mr. SHERLEY. Will you supply information as to what moneys have been allotted out of existing appropriations for this purpose? Capt. DALY. Yes, sir.

Mr. SHERLEY. Also what chartering you are doing now that this would relieve you of and what the chartering is costing you? Capt. DALY. Yes, sir.

COAST ARTILLERY BOAT SERVICE.

(See pp. 334, 337, 595.)

Mr. SHERLEY. The next item is for the Coast Artillery service and for official, military, and garrison purposes, including the purchase, construction, and repair of mine planters, and cable boats and ships, and for the supplies and equipment necessary for the maintenance and operation of said vessels, $627,500.

Capt. DALY. That is for the purchase of two 60-foot steam launches at $20,000 each. I can hand you this memorandum so that you may have these items before you.

Mr. SHERLEY. Two 64-foot D. B. boats, at $30,000 each, $60,000. What are "D. B." boats?